AI question.

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Damian WSD
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AI question.

#1 Post by Damian WSD » Jun 14 2018

Can someone share with me his own opiniom about AI problems of this part of the game?
Whether is AI so stupid as in the previous part of this game? (SR 2010)
Is this game worthy?
Last edited by Damian WSD on Jun 14 2018, edited 1 time in total.
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d-bassett
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Re: AI question.

#2 Post by d-bassett » Jun 14 2018

In my opinion the AI is a complex topic, it can be easily beat by an experienced player when set on the lower difficulties but when set on very hard it should give even the best of players some trouble to beat. As there are several layers of AI in the game, was there a specific area you were wondering about? Once again, only my opinion but the game is definitely worth picking up if you are a fan of the genre, it is the most in depth and realistic strategy game I have played to date.

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Re: AI question.

#3 Post by bowtie » Jun 14 2018

Yes the AI is dumb. But that's ANY AI IN ANY GAME. You can and will figure out how to beat the AI. It's still an AI and you're a human.

I would still recommend this game, though. 100% this is my favorite game. It's tons of fun. If you like history (and/or alternate history) and economics, you might find it enjoyable. It's not as focused on war as say - the Hearts of Iron series. It's much more freeform, more like Crusader Kings or Victoria.

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Damian WSD
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Re: AI question.

#4 Post by Damian WSD » Jun 14 2018

Thx for an answer.
But still, have some questions.
So, tell me please, in this part of the game, AI can perform, for example: sea OP like: sea ​​landing or air OP?
This should be rather, an important part of this game, like for me. AI should be able to perform complex tactical operations.
Patterns of this type of AI behavior should be not very difficult to write. It's a matter of reflection only.

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Re: AI question.

#5 Post by YoMomma » Jun 14 2018

No, no advanced tactics by AI.

At best i get surprised by an AI attack, like Germany had whole Europe, half of Russia, which was eliminated by that time and were coming to me in the middle east playing Iran. I had puppets in Africa and was eliminating US. Ofcourse i secured the border by Iran. I had to fight thousands of infantry and tank units and pull all my forces from North America, which wasnt a real problem at that time, since US is actually super easy to beat (see MP strategic bombers topic). But yeah it was very cloose and was pulled back all the way to Teheran. With special forces and fast producing infantry i managed to come out as victor in the end, at which point i just quit the game since i became so big.

Honestly i cant remember last time i lost a game, but i guess you can expect that after playing thousands of hours. When you entrench cities, make use of defensive terrain and let the AI come to you its just a mather of time. I manage to defend Netherlands all the time against Germany.
Im just glad i run my own unit file.

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Re: AI question.

#6 Post by Damian WSD » Jun 14 2018

Hm, as i suspected.
So, can you compare these two titles: SR 2010 and this one, in the patterns of behavior of AI?
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Re: AI question.

#7 Post by YoMomma » Jun 14 2018

I dont have SR2010, but i hear a couple of features are missing from that title by old timers.

Compared to SR2020, the ai acts smarter. It tries to make use of defensive terrains as well, which you have to prevent or theres a big chance you will be overrun.

Biggest change is prolly merchant marines. Land troops turn into a merchant marine ship, at which point you can sail them all over the world. In the beginning this was a real annoying to me since whole AI armies were getting annihilated, but since they improved pathing and some other things, they act much better now. If they have the right infantry to embark offshore, you might even see annexed islands. In 1 game of mine Russia took over all of Asia.
Im just glad i run my own unit file.

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Re: AI question.

#8 Post by Zuikaku » Jun 14 2018

AI is somewhat better in SRU, but don't expect too much. Especially from naval AI :-(
Please teach AI to liberate and colonize instead of only annexing!

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Re: AI question.

#9 Post by Damian WSD » Jun 14 2018

sad story... i don`t understand why they can`t do it well.
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Re: AI question.

#10 Post by Zuikaku » Jun 14 2018

Damian WSD wrote:
Jun 14 2018
sad story... i don`t understand why they can`t do it well.

well, it is better, but don't expect miracles :wink:

AI does some dumb things but sometimes seems it gets sparks of lucidity... or luck. It gaved me tons of fun... but also frustrations since I feel some aspects of the AI deserve more attention and priority than the one given by developers. But, as BGs have said, they need to run the company and might have different priorities. But we still hope... [_]B
Please teach AI to liberate and colonize instead of only annexing!

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Re: AI question.

#11 Post by Damian WSD » Jun 15 2018

So, if they want to push the company forward, better, for them is to focus on important issues, like graphic for example or mentioned AI problems.
Did you compared graphic older SR 2010 with new SR Ultimate? That should be for you really an amazing discovery.
Compare these 2 titles (graphic) on Youtube and you will find a pure regres, certainly, not progres.
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Re: AI question.

#12 Post by Nerei » Jun 15 2018

Looking at SR2010 I mainly see a game with a fairly jarring art-style. Art is naturally about preferences but personally I do not find low detail stylised Civilization II style sprites on a realistic satellite photo to be great. Had it been counters or had the map been in the same art-style as the sprites I would find it far, far better.

I cannot help but look at a 6-8 frame tank sprite zipping across a satellite photo of the alps and think "those belong in different games". To me that is not positive.


Not saying the current art is perfect or anything but at least with 3D terrain it looks more consistant.


Really for art I would say focus on being consistant more than "pretty". Pretty is expensive and you will never beat Paradox or Sega anyway so the people wanting to buy a pretty grand strategy game will pick that first anyway.


As for AI the problem is really that it is far harder to fake intelligence in grand strategy games like this. In say tactical combat games those tactically placed archers on the walls are probably placed there by a game designer and not the AI and that fancy move the enemy wizard pulled off by time-stopping and blasting your mage is probably also scripted.
That surprising counter attack from an odd angle that you never saw coming is likewise probably scripted.
That is not something you can do here.

I have yet to find a grand strategy game like this with more than acceptable AI. Paradox game AI's last I tried one of their games certainly was not impressive and that is most likely with a far greater budget.

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Re: AI question.

#13 Post by Damian WSD » Jun 15 2018

1) hm, disagree with your evaluation concerning SR series graphic. But this is ofcourse only my subjective observation.
Look at tanks, aircrafts, ships in SR2010 and do this same with SR 2020 or later version of the mentioned game. It simply can`t be compared.
But only, as i mentioned above: it`s my private opinion. So I respect your opinion fully.
2) What is concerning about AI possibilities. As follow:
- Ai can`t use naval units at all
- this same observation about air units
- lack of necessary air support in air or land OP`s.
- lack of naval landing OP`s
- improper attack with ICBM missiles fired from SSBN submarines.
- improper attack with maneuvering rockets on land or naval targets.
- in one word: completly lack of tactical or strategical thinking of AI.

Everything about of course SR2010. But if i`m reading well all topics concerning AI OP`s, observations of others are the same as my own.

- no sea patrols
- no air patrols
- no sea activity.
It`s look like unfinished strategic game released too early. And only It's a pity that they did it like that.
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Re: AI question.

#14 Post by Balthagor » Jun 15 2018

I've only followed part of the thread, but I feel the need to add some comments to some of this;
Damian WSD wrote:
Jun 15 2018
- Ai can`t use naval units at all
- this same observation about air units
- lack of necessary air support in air or land OP`s.
- lack of naval landing OP`s
- improper attack with ICBM missiles fired from SSBN submarines.
- improper attack with maneuvering rockets on land or naval targets.
- in one word: completly lack of tactical or strategical thinking of AI.
Looking at SRU/SRGW;

The AI does use Naval units all over the place. It will chase down incursions and assembles fleets at times. It's biggest weakness is it's use of carriers.
The AI does use air units but is cautious about how it uses them. It will chase incursions. It will create hotspots that include air support that will call air units there.
Often the lack of air support is that it has already been shot down.

I'm unsure what you mean about ICBMs/rockets.

You're certainly entitled to your opinions, but they seem to be based on false impressions about the game.
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Damian WSD
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Re: AI question.

#15 Post by Damian WSD » Jun 15 2018

|O oh, my friend, i'm writing about SR 2010 and you? I'm sure what I'm writing about.
ICBM= intercontinental ballistic missiles. for example Trident I
When you load the rockets and give the order to attack specific target, for example land base, then sub will fire all rockets in place of one.
and should be like with land base. One target= single rocket.

--------------------------
"The AI does use Naval units all over the place" really? Never saw this, and i know well SR 2010.
But, if Gattle Goat have modified the behavior of AI in SRU, then obviously it's a good news. But as above, i had read already info from other players about AI behaviour and there is still much to be desired.

example from above: "well, it is better, but don't expect miracles :wink:"
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