So... combat

General discussion related to the game goes here.

Moderators: Balthagor, Legend, Moderators

Post Reply
Bambilambi
Corporal
Posts: 7
Joined: Nov 01 2017
Human: Yes

So... combat

Post by Bambilambi »

Hello everyone!
I've tried google and YouTube, but i cannot find the answer. Perhaps because I'm blind:).. anyway my question is regarding combat:

I started the Barbarossa campaign selected a bunch of units and made battle-groups. They advanced upon the enemy and the battle ensued. the fastest units arrived frst etc...
I noticed however that the three basic unit types (inf/tank/art) became separated after a certain length of advancement, which means they cannot support each other correctly. that was especially noticeable in 50+ unit battle-groups that changed direction somewhat. One example I saw was a bunch of artillery fighting alone with tanks advancing a few hexes away...

I of course want the tank and infantry first and artillery behind in a battle-group. Can this be done somehow?

For me at the moment the game feels a bit like children playing football, everyone is around the ball:)... no strategy, just a blob of units with no internal coordination.
Have I missed something in the combat unit management?
I could i suppose do this manually by selecting all tanks and stop those units for a while while the other catch up etc, but it doesn't feel doable even in the limited Barbarossa campaign.


Is it basically select a bunch of units and randomly advance type of game (as I have seen in a few games on YouTube)?
(Pretty vital if i am gonna keep the game, my two hours on steam is almost up on tutorial and economy playtime...:/)
evildari
Brigadier Gen.
Posts: 629
Joined: Aug 10 2017
Human: Yes

Re: So... combat

Post by evildari »

Hello,
select your favorite Blob, put em into a formation you like, then go to unit orders screen look at the most right of the popup window.
There enable formation move and then another box appears that reads like "common speed" - enable it and your fast artillery moves as slow as your puny battle tanks.
my mods
http://www.bgforums.com/forums/viewtopi ... 79&t=25932 (even techs and units for everyone - AI will own you too)
http://www.bgforums.com/forums/viewtopi ... 79&t=29326 (MARSX2)
GIJoe597
Board Admin
Posts: 2918
Joined: Sep 29 2008
Human: Yes
Contact:

Re: So... combat

Post by GIJoe597 »

In this video I made for a Steam user, it shows the Formation Move option. If you put your units in a formation manually, then turn on Formation Move you also get an icon to force units to move at same speed. The group will move at the speed of the slowest unit, but they should stay together. This is does always work for naval units for some reason if they are travelling a large distance, but will work for ground units.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDEdFFf ... 4q&index=9



EDIT: Looks like Evil and I posted at same time. :)
https://www.youtube.com/user/GIJoe597


Older/retired gamers, who do not tolerate foolishness.
http://steamcommunity.com/groups/USARG
Bambilambi
Corporal
Posts: 7
Joined: Nov 01 2017
Human: Yes

Re: So... combat

Post by Bambilambi »

Ok, thanks guys!

appreciate the tips, but I of course have a few follow up questions:)

About formation moves, it seems like a good thing if i want to advance in a broad front i guess. I assume that the formation cohesion break when they meet a front (for land units)...?
Same speed seems (in theory) to be better for retaining a resemblance of cohesion.


Do people use these abilites ingame for land combat?
Do you two use it or is it general blobbing that is the standard modus?


Edit: in practice it fails a bit sadly so no go... I guess it was made for naval units.
GIJoe597
Board Admin
Posts: 2918
Joined: Sep 29 2008
Human: Yes
Contact:

Re: So... combat

Post by GIJoe597 »

I never blob, I set a front line with each hex containing 7 brigades. I will have formation/common speed move toggled on, but I still move each "formation" (the 7 brigades in a hex) manually. It may be hard to visualize in text, if required I can create a short video. But this is the way I do it, does not mean it is how you want to do it.
https://www.youtube.com/user/GIJoe597


Older/retired gamers, who do not tolerate foolishness.
http://steamcommunity.com/groups/USARG
Bambilambi
Corporal
Posts: 7
Joined: Nov 01 2017
Human: Yes

Re: So... combat

Post by Bambilambi »

Thanks!

I understand perfectly what you mean. That is of course how its supposed to be used on land units. not on several stacks but on each stack separately.
I come from games like HOI and war in the east, so i want that kind of combat, with breakthroughs and surrounds and correct configurations on the attacking units (inf with art support for example).

How good is the land AI?
Can it handle that kind of sophistication or does it loose badly?
/B
GIJoe597
Board Admin
Posts: 2918
Joined: Sep 29 2008
Human: Yes
Contact:

Re: So... combat

Post by GIJoe597 »

I am a supporter of BG for many years, but that kind of combat is not present in SR series. I also play HOI and other war games where the ai is capable of those things and wish it was so in SR. (I have had some major losses in fleet battles in HOI in many games.) In SR each unit is considered independent by the ai, it can and will move a single arty to attack something. The only time the ai is passable is when it has overwhelming force and it just blobs with it. That is not just land units by the way, the ai cannot form fleets for naval units. it will move them same as land units, one at a time with no rhyme nor reason. Those of us that enjoy the game for years and years, tend to engage in mild role play and move our units manually. In my case I generally try to act and react as would be the case in reality.

As I typed earlier about each hex having 7 brigades, I typically form this like so;

6 Inf(mech if possible)
1 Tank

The hex immediately behind may contain 7 x Arty with 7 x Supply Trucks and 7 x AA setting to left or right of the supply trucks. Mostly depends on the enemy.

In desert environments I may use attack helicopters if it is early game and there is a lack of supply and/or air bases in range. These can be re-supplied via transport helos sitting behind the lines several hexes.

In essence, my tactics depend on whom I am fighting, the location/environment and era. I also very much enjoy using Air Cav in the jungles of S. America and Africa.
https://www.youtube.com/user/GIJoe597


Older/retired gamers, who do not tolerate foolishness.
http://steamcommunity.com/groups/USARG
Bambilambi
Corporal
Posts: 7
Joined: Nov 01 2017
Human: Yes

Re: So... combat

Post by Bambilambi »

Hmm, too bad. It sounds like the combat part of the game will be a cakewalk for me then.

the construction part is interesting and so is the scope. I am the kind of nerdy player that can beat easily HOI4 (with expert ai2.0) without the doing any of the gamey exploits in buildup or combat.
Therefore it is pretty important for me that the combat AI at least is decent.

I'm looking at a refund sadly, still got 15 minutes of playtime before the two hours are up... I will try to judge the ai again during that time.

thanks for helping me with my questions!
/B
GIJoe597
Board Admin
Posts: 2918
Joined: Sep 29 2008
Human: Yes
Contact:

Re: So... combat

Post by GIJoe597 »

Oh, HOI 4. I thought you meant a real HOI game.. apologies.

By the way, I do not want to text you out of purchasing a BG title. SR does have some good things going for it, but you have to keep in mind you are a "Supreme Ruler" not a front line general. The combat is only a part of the over all game experience. And there is no comparison when playing Multi Player. It is awesome.
https://www.youtube.com/user/GIJoe597


Older/retired gamers, who do not tolerate foolishness.
http://steamcommunity.com/groups/USARG
evildari
Brigadier Gen.
Posts: 629
Joined: Aug 10 2017
Human: Yes

Re: So... combat

Post by evildari »

GIJoe597 wrote:Oh, HOI 4. I thought you meant a real HOI game.. apologies.

By the way, I do not want to text you out of purchasing a BG title. SR does have some good things going for it, but you have to keep in mind you are a "Supreme Ruler" not a front line general. The combat is only a part of the over all game experience. And there is no comparison when playing Multi Player. It is awesome.
as someone long time ago said: win the war first, then go to battle.

I usually let the AI generals do the conquering - maybe helping them by using hotspots or with naval landings.
As long as i get at least an even KDR, i dont catch them and sent the blob into the right direction.
my mods
http://www.bgforums.com/forums/viewtopi ... 79&t=25932 (even techs and units for everyone - AI will own you too)
http://www.bgforums.com/forums/viewtopi ... 79&t=29326 (MARSX2)
Bambilambi
Corporal
Posts: 7
Joined: Nov 01 2017
Human: Yes

Re: So... combat

Post by Bambilambi »

GIJoe597 wrote:Oh, HOI 4. I thought you meant a real HOI game.. apologies.

By the way, I do not want to text you out of purchasing a BG title. SR does have some good things going for it, but you have to keep in mind you are a "Supreme Ruler" not a front line general. The combat is only a part of the over all game experience. And there is no comparison when playing Multi Player. It is awesome.
Awesome burn!:)
I almost don't want to reply... but yes, I of course play HOI 3 as well, with and without BICE, but I actually think the overall combat AI is better in HOI 4:)... even if it is lacking in many other parts. Sorry If I was unclear. Sadly i never played HOI 2, I came into the HOI scene after that, but I've heard good things about it.

Thanks Elvidari an GiJoe.

This is like you both say a different game with broader focus. And yes I am pretty sure it will shine in especially multiplayer.
About texting me out of, I think you two have actually convinced me of keeping the game:)

There is more to explore here.
/B
GIJoe597
Board Admin
Posts: 2918
Joined: Sep 29 2008
Human: Yes
Contact:

Re: So... combat

Post by GIJoe597 »

Indeed there is more...
https://www.youtube.com/user/GIJoe597


Older/retired gamers, who do not tolerate foolishness.
http://steamcommunity.com/groups/USARG
Post Reply

Return to “General Discussion - SRUltimate”