Battle of the Atlantic (New Feature)

[George Geczy]

(This has also been cross-posted to the Steam forums)

As a direct result of feedback on the Steam and BattleGoat forums we've developed a new feature included in Supreme Ruler Ultimate and today's update of SR1936, the "Battle of the Atlantic".

We will be making this a lobby option for player to turn on or off, right now it defaults ON with the 1936/1940/1941 maps, but is OFF for the other Sandbox/Campaign/Scenarios. (The default can also be changed by modding the game scenario files.)

The Battle of the Atlantic ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of ... 80%931945) ) was the ongoing campaign of German U-Boats against British merchant shipping during the war. While historians have differing opinions of the real threat and effect of the German U-Boat menace, during the war it was uncertain whether the Germans would be able to inflict substantial economic damage if the campaign was successful. The results on history if the Germans had been more determined, or the British less capable in fighting back, will never be known for sure, but now you can try for yourself in Supreme Ruler...

The Battle of the Atlantic requires a few pre-requisites to take effect:
- The commerce-raiding nation can be any nation (not just Germany), but they must be at war with the UK.
- The UK is always the target of the Battle of the Atlantic.
- The UK must be at peace with either Canada and/or the US.

Commerce raiding naval units can be either surface ships or subs. The battle "area" is the North Atlantic, roughly from Iceland down to the bottom of Spain, from the North American east coast to the coast of France.

The commerce raider must be moving or patrolling to interdict a supply convoy. If a convoy is successful attacked, the UK will loose a percentage of it's last day world market purchase of one of the products/goods it is importing. Upon successful attack, an on-map notice will be displayed, and the raider unit will be given a "kill" and experience (although this does not affect kills/losses shown in the scorecard).

Being a new feature, we have not had a chance to balance the elements of this, so we welcome feedback and comments. In particular, do successful raids happen too often for patrolling units? Is the lost goods too much (or too little)?

We have a few tweaks planned for this element, plus a few fixes (for instance, right now it is possible to sink a shipment of Electricity ... oops). Comments welcome!

[SGTscuba]

Just read this and have questions:

1) Do the raiders actually stay on the map so I can sink them as the UK.
2) Can I see the convoys and how can I escort them directly (so I can defend them directly)?
3) Could you extend this to more nations if this works properly as Japan might be another good country to siege in this way (and its historic too!)?

[Aragos]

I saw this last night in my first game. It seemed pretty cool.

One suggestion: Show the convoy routes on map, perhaps when the Supply filter is set to ON. This will enable players to keep the routes open or to raid them. As it is now, as best I can see, it is a line running along the coast from southern UK to Gibraltar, following the Portuguese/Spanish border.

[Zuikaku]

this system should be possible to all regions trading resources across oceans.

e.g. to disrupt brasilian trade with europe....

[SGTscuba]

this system should be possible to all regions trading resources across oceans.

e.g. to disrupt brasilian trade with europe....

Exactly

[way2co0l]

I do agree with you guys, but the fact they added this part alone is good enough for now. I would definitely like to see it expanded in the future though.

[SGTscuba]

Me 2, I hope this is the beginning of the implementation.

[Nitrous Oxide]

this system should be possible to all regions trading resources across oceans.

e.g. to disrupt brasilian trade with europe....

I wonder if it would be possible for them to change what they have now to be generally applicable or not. For example, in 2020... well there's no Battle of the Atlantic...

[George Geczy]

Just read this and have questions:

1) Do the raiders actually stay on the map so I can sink them as the UK.

The commerce raiders are any surface naval or submarine units that have a naval attack capability, have ammo, and are at war with the UK. So when a German sub, for instance, scores an attack on a supply convoy, there will be an on-map notice at the exact location where the action happened. At that point the UK or its allies can try to hunt down the raider. If the AI is playing the UK, it will launch patrols in the area to try to find the enemy ship/subs.

2) Can I see the convoys and how can I escort them directly (so I can defend them directly)?

No, this is not part of the design. There has been discussion about this, but the goal is to create a game system that can accomplish the historical element (attacking supply routes to the UK) without being overly complicated or micro-manage-y. As I've mentioned before, I think that the "Battle of the Atlantic" could be an entire game all by itself if the concept was expanded on, but that's not what we were looking to do. By its nature this design is meant to allow the UK's enemies to affect its resupply, and force the UK to patrol and control the North Atlantic waters.

Show the convoy routes on map, perhaps when the Supply filter is set to ON. This will enable players to keep the routes open or to raid them. As it is now, as best I can see, it is a line running along the coast from southern UK to Gibraltar, following the Portuguese/Spanish border.

After doing background research on the actual Battle of the Atlantic, especially the period from 1939 to 1942, there were no strongly defined "convoy routes", and so that's the way we've done it here as well. The large majority of merchant shipping was sunk in an area approximately bounded by Iceland in the North, the bottom of Spain/Portugal in the south, the US coast in the west and France in the east.... so that is the area where convoys can be attacked.

[George Geczy]

Regarding allowing the feature to be used in other areas of the world... this too was considered and discussed.

In many ways the UK situation was unique. Japan seems to be a similar example, but their "control zone" would not be the Pacific, it would be the Sea of Japan / East China Sea area. They didn't have an "overseas friends" supply line like the UK, instead most of their incoming goods were from their own colonies, brought up along the asian coastline. It would be possible to add this zone in, but not nearly as interesting or historical as the Atlantic battle.

Cuba is also mentioned, although the Cuban blockade isn't really a direct historical precedent. Plus, it's a pretty minor player in the world. Australia could be one as well, although it is a much larger land mass with a lot more available access routes.

For nations that are not islands, it doesn't really make sense because so much of their supply can come overland, either through neutrals or through other supply chains.

As we get feedback on this feature we'll look at expanding it and/or making it available to modders.

-- George.

[Nitrous Oxide]

or making it available to modders.

Pretty please with a cherry on top?

[Aragos]

Regarding allowing the feature to be used in other areas of the world... this too was considered and discussed.

In many ways the UK situation was unique. Japan seems to be a similar example, but their "control zone" would not be the Pacific, it would be the Sea of Japan / East China Sea area. They didn't have an "overseas friends" supply line like the UK, instead most of their incoming goods were from their own colonies, brought up along the asian coastline. It would be possible to add this zone in, but not nearly as interesting or historical as the Atlantic battle.

Cuba is also mentioned, although the Cuban blockade isn't really a direct historical precedent. Plus, it's a pretty minor player in the world. Australia could be one as well, although it is a much larger land mass with a lot more available access routes.

For nations that are not islands, it doesn't really make sense because so much of their supply can come overland, either through neutrals or through other supply chains.

As we get feedback on this feature we'll look at expanding it and/or making it available to modders.

-- George.

Historically, the US submarine campaign against Japan was both more destructive and more effective than the German-led Battle of the Atlantic.

Just sayin.

A great source on the US campaign is Clay Blair's "Silent Victory."

[Zuikaku]

I' we got the idea. Why not dividing oceans into:
North Atlantic east and west, South Atlantic east and west, Mediterranean, Baltic, Indian ocean east and west, North Pacific east and west, South Pacific east and west.

So, if we are at war with Brazil and want to disrupt it's trade, we have to place our subs/ships in western south Atlantic since Brazilian coast lies there.

If we want to disrupt US trade, we can place subs in western north Atlantic or eastern north Pacific to raid shipping.

If we want to hurt Italy, we send subs into Mediterranean.

It would also be somewhat easier to defend convoys too, since Brazilian player woul'd know where to search for subs with hunter-killer groups.

Is that doable and possible?

[Zuikaku]

As we get feedback on this feature we'll look at expanding it and/or making it available to modders.

-- George.

I know this is a long shot, but is there any chance for this feature to be expanded to other major regions (USA, Japan, Italy, Brazil...)?

[YoMomma]

What about Somalia? or we still in '36 mode?