market prices are unrealistic. add

[georgios]

maitenance costs aren't linked to People's income in anyway. Again there is a large private sector. You don't employ everyone..

So where go these costs? It's money, not raw materials to go to garbage after use. And money circulates.

And labor costs are directly figured into production costs of a good not maintenence costs. Which is why low unemployment and/or high GDP can increase your production costs. More money you're people make the more costs you to produce a good.

So unemployment and GPD/c are linked with this invisible private sector? And government can't control them?

[Fistalis]

maitenance costs aren't linked to People's income in anyway. Again there is a large private sector. You don't employ everyone..

So where go these costs? It's money, not raw materials to go to garbage after use. And money circulates.

And labor costs are directly figured into production costs of a good not maintenence costs. Which is why low unemployment and/or high GDP can increase your production costs. More money you're people make the more costs you to produce a good.

So unemployment and GPD/c are linked with this invisible private sector? And government can't control them?

Through taxation.. just like real life. Low taxes allows slow steady growth .. high taxes can either stall or contract it.
Where the maintenence costs go? who knows. But again labor costs are figured into cost of production of a good. Maintanence costs might go to the population but its insignificant compared to the rest of the wages. (the maintenance costs likely just poof since Afaik there is no direct link to them to any other system)

[georgios]

Service industries.. like restaurants.. hotels, theatres etc etc. Not social service.. service INDUSTRY.

Ok, tell me now if these industries generate their own FIAT money, and how is it correllated with government's spend policy.

As to why I say this.. is because this has all been explained previously and could be found with search...

No, there are only questions about this topic in this forum, not a clear answer. If there is a thread with the formulas of economy please send me a link and I promise, I will never ask again.

[Fistalis]

Service industries.. like restaurants.. hotels, theatres etc etc. Not social service.. service INDUSTRY.

Ok, tell me now if these industries generate their own FIAT money, and how is it correllated with government's spend policy.

As to why I say this.. is because this has all been explained previously and could be found with search...

No, there are only questions about this topic in this forum, not a clear answer. If there is a thread with the formulas of economy please send me a link and I promise, I will never ask again.

It does not correlated with the government spend policy. The system creates money as its needed.. again there is no complex banking system. You keep acting like there is a complex central bank system in the game and there's not. These phantom industries don't need to create money.. it simply exists.

As for exact economic formulas BG has never released the exact formulas and likely won't. I'm simply explaining you how these systems are connected.. which has been explained.

But I'm kind of sick of repeating myself so good luck getting better answers from someone else.

[georgios]

Through taxation.. just like real life. Low taxes allows slow steady growth .. high taxes can either stall or contract it.

Ok, perhaps in real life it works. But in SR high taxation simply leads to inflation, not to unemployment rise, or GDP/c fall.

Perhaps this is a realistic depiction of what in real life is called stagflation..

Where the maintenence costs go? who knows.

Hm.. this is not an answer...

But again labor costs are figured into cost of production of a good.

Ok, I don't disagree with this.

Maintanence costs might go to the population

Of course they go to the population. Otherwise the system has a FIAT destroyer of money!

but its insignificant compared to the rest of the wages.

They are not insignificant, sometimes economy suffers from maintenance costs of plants that are not operating because of high production cost.

(the maintenance costs likely just poof since Afaik there is no direct link to them to any other system)

But they should be somewhere in the money circulating cycle..

[Fistalis]

Through taxation.. just like real life. Low taxes allows slow steady growth .. high taxes can either stall or contract it.

Ok, perhaps in real life it works. But in SR high taxation simply leads to inflation, not to unemployment rise, or GDP/c fall.

Perhaps this is a realistic depiction of what in real life is called stagflation..

Where the maintenence costs go? who knows.

Hm.. this is not an answer...

But again labor costs are figured into cost of production of a good.

Ok, I don't disagree with this.

Maintanence costs might go to the population

Of course they go to the population. Otherwise the system has a FIAT destroyer of money!

but its insignificant compared to the rest of the wages.

They are not insignificant, sometimes economy suffers from maintenance costs of plants that are not operating because of high production cost.

(the maintenance costs likely just poof since Afaik there is no direct link to them to any other system)

But they should be somewhere in the money circulating cycle..

Lol You don't have to agree with it.. That's how it works.
We're not talking about how you think it should work we're talking about how it actually works.

• Labor costs are figured directly into production costs.
• A high GDP means the average worker gets paid more which raises labor costs. This is why a high gdp means higher production costs.
• A low unemployment rate means workers are in greater demand. Which raises labor costs. Which is why again.. higher production costs.
• Maintenance costs are not linked to any other system that I'm aware of.
• Maintenance costs are insignificant when compared to the labor costs paid out through production. So even though they aren't recirculating its miniscule in comparison to the actual labor costs collected by the population via production costs anyway.

Again though.. its not about how I/you or anyone else thinks it should work work.. you're asking how it DOES work

Since you seem to want to tell me that I'm wrong .. again good luck getting better answers from someone else. (or if you're lucky enough to find someone who is knowledgeable and wants to repeat answers you have already been told, be amazed when they tell you the same things I just did.)

[georgios]

These phantom industries don't need to create money.. it simply exists.

And who gave it to them?
Of course, at the start of the game they have an initial treasury, as we the players have. But what happens then?

Or is this initial treasury infinite?

[Fistalis]

These phantom industries don't need to create money.. it simply exists.

And who gave it to them?
Of course, at the start of the game they have an initial treasury, as we the players have. But what happens then?

Or is this initial treasury infinite?

Now you're catching on. The game doesn't keep track of how much money is in circulation.. how much money the private sector has, how much money the world market has etc etc. There is NO complex banking system. The game does the math and POOF the money exists.

[georgios]

Again though.. its not about how I/you or anyone else thinks it should work work.. you're asking how it DOES work.

The problem in this discussion is that you are repeating things that I didn't asked because they are wellknown general theories.
I asked some very simple things. How is all this programmed. You said that the formulas are not puplished. So they exist, but you simply don't know them. Where is the problem? Why are you offending me? I simply want information for better gameplay.

[georgios]

The game doesn't keep track of how much money is in circulation.. how much money the private sector has, how much money the world market has etc etc. There is NO complex banking system.

It would not be a complex bank system..

The game does the math and POOF the money exists.

So this math is the bank system! For this math I'm asking for!

[georgios]

http://www.bgforums.com/forums/viewtopi ... 69&t=23096


This is another recent post with similar topic, about money. There the authors are asking for the same things. I'm not the only interested to know.


Because POOF is not an answer.. Computer don't calculates a random POOF. it processes data..

[suaske666]

1. Transportation costs are included in infrastructure spending.

yeah i'm not talking about that, i'm talking about the influence they have on the price of goods.

2. Market price is determined by "world market margin", a multiplier of "base cost" of a product, which in turn is multiplied with an unknown factor correllated with GDP/c of each region.

right that's why i'm suggesting adding transport cost to this so that you don't get to a point where it's cheaper to import metal than produce it at home.

3. World trade is not done directly between regions. Exporters sell products to the world market and importers buy them from the world market too. Even if you conquer all world, you will still export products and import them back next day!

i'm aware of that, and i understand this will not change (nothing will change), i'm just saying that while this certainly works for modern day scenarios, and even for a cold war scenario to an extent, it's an extremely stupid system for a world at war scenario. again this is just a fact, just like it's a fact that they were aware of this when making this game, but decided it's too much work to change just like 70% of the previous game. i know i sound more than just a bit harsh, but the truth is this is a poor excuse for a world war two game. it's a good engine but it just didn't get the work it needed to make the transition from modern to ww2. it just didn't. and it wont. ever. and i feel silly because Fistalis predicted this on this vary forum way before the game came out, just a few days after it was even announced he said he'll only buy it because he wants to make a modern world mod for it, but he thought it won't work in ww2, and i was silly enough not to listen.

[georgios]

i'm talking about the influence they have on the price of goods.

Hm.. for some products like oil, we can say that transportation cost really does not play any role.. Oil has a global price, and is not cheaper if you live closer to the wells. The whole transportation cost is distributed to all petroleum and closer clients pay a little more to cover the cost for the farthest. And this cost is the world market margin coefficient.

Surely this is not realistic in ages before multinational oil companies and globalised commodity exchange markets.

adding transport cost to this so that you don't get to a point where it's cheaper to import metal than produce it at home.

Even with transportation cost included, sometimes it will stil be cheaper to import than produce at home. This is the reason that trade exists!

it's an extremely stupid system for a world at war scenario.

Yes, trade system was from the begining unrealistic and needs update.

And above all, better explanation (without poofs) of how it works. I stil wait for answers.