Italy vs Yugo

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barkhauer
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Italy vs Yugo

Post by barkhauer »

As Italy, in the campaign, I finished off Ethiopia, then decided to go after some nice vacation spots along the Adriatic coast. Declared war on Yugo, watched the AI minister try to push forward an attack. What happened was that every time land switched in this order, YUGO->Italy->YUGO, the land belonged to a puppet of YUGO named for the land's loyalty. EG, Yugoslav Croatia. I assume this is how the new engine handles liberation, colony creation on the AI's behalf, etc.

What really made this a problem instead of just a quirk of the engine, though, was that the peace/war states didn't inherit properly. The situation was something like this:

Italy Wars
Yugoslavia

Yugoslavia Wars
Italy

Yugoslav Croatia Wars
Italy

Please note that the puppet is at war with me, but I am not at war with them. Yugoslav units can attack me through their puppet territory, but I cannot counterattack through Croatian land. Additionally, though the right-click and UI options appear correctly, I cannot actually declare war upon Croatia (when I try, nothing happens).

I have a save game if one would be useful.
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Zuikaku
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Re: Italy vs Yugo

Post by Zuikaku »

Did AI ever offered you a peace offer?
Please teach AI everything!
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number47
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Re: Italy vs Yugo

Post by number47 »

Yeah, I just noticed the same thing as barkhauer. I was playing Yugoslavia and I got attacked by Hungary. They got me by surprise so took some of my land before I could react. What happens now when I'm in counter-offensive in every land that I "liberate" that was originally Yugoslav, becomes Croatian or Serbian or whatever loyalty it had. In other words, once I loose land, I can't get it back... :-?
"If everyone is thinking alike, someone isn't thinking."
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Zuikaku
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Re: Italy vs Yugo

Post by Zuikaku »

number47 wrote:Yeah, I just noticed the same thing as barkhauer. I was playing Yugoslavia and I got attacked by Hungary. They got me by surprise so took some of my land before I could react. What happens now when I'm in counter-offensive in every land that I "liberate" that was originally Yugoslav, becomes Croatian or Serbian or whatever loyalty it had. In other words, once I loose land, I can't get it back... :-?
And that is not ahistoricall at all.... I vote for this feature to stay. Better than not being able to resurrect countries.
The only thing that maybe needs a change is that country that looses liberated part (here Yugoslavia) got a casus belly or automatically declares war on liberated nation. And attacker automatically gets transit treaties in liberated country, so he can defend it and push further....
Please teach AI everything!
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number47
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Re: Italy vs Yugo

Post by number47 »

Zuikaku wrote:
number47 wrote:Yeah, I just noticed the same thing as barkhauer. I was playing Yugoslavia and I got attacked by Hungary. They got me by surprise so took some of my land before I could react. What happens now when I'm in counter-offensive in every land that I "liberate" that was originally Yugoslav, becomes Croatian or Serbian or whatever loyalty it had. In other words, once I loose land, I can't get it back... :-?
And that is not ahistoricall at all.... I vote for this feature to stay. Better than not being able to resurrect countries.
The only thing that maybe needs a change is that country that looses liberated part (here Yugoslavia) got a casus belly or automatically declares war on liberated nation. And attacker automatically gets transit treaties in liberated country, so he can defend it and push further....
You are not reading what I wrote :wink:
When Hungary takes land from Yugo (me) it turns into Hungary. When Yugo than takes that land back from Hungary it doesn't turn back to Yugo but it than becomes Croatia or Serbia or whatever the loyalty was in that hex. This is wrong :P

This is probably WAD but they didn't take in account countries that don't have their loyalties present in game or situations like this...

*for Norther America players:
the situation would go like this:
USA is in war with Germany. Germany makes amphibious landing and takes New York and few surrounding hexes. USA than drives Germany back to the sea but the liberated land does not become USA but New York (as in Federal state of New York).
"If everyone is thinking alike, someone isn't thinking."
- General George Patton Jr
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Zuikaku
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Re: Italy vs Yugo

Post by Zuikaku »

number47 wrote:
Zuikaku wrote:
number47 wrote:Yeah, I just noticed the same thing as barkhauer. I was playing Yugoslavia and I got attacked by Hungary. They got me by surprise so took some of my land before I could react. What happens now when I'm in counter-offensive in every land that I "liberate" that was originally Yugoslav, becomes Croatian or Serbian or whatever loyalty it had. In other words, once I loose land, I can't get it back... :-?
And that is not ahistoricall at all.... I vote for this feature to stay. Better than not being able to resurrect countries.
The only thing that maybe needs a change is that country that looses liberated part (here Yugoslavia) got a casus belly or automatically declares war on liberated nation. And attacker automatically gets transit treaties in liberated country, so he can defend it and push further....
You are not reading what I wrote :wink:
When Hungary takes land from Yugo (me) it turns into Hungary. When Yugo than takes that land back from Hungary it doesn't turn back to Yugo but it than becomes Croatia or Serbia or whatever the loyalty was in that hex. This is wrong :P

This is probably WAD but they didn't take in account countries that don't have their loyalties present in game or situations like this...

*for Norther America players:
the situation would go like this:
USA is in war with Germany. Germany makes amphibious landing and takes New York and few surrounding hexes. USA than drives Germany back to the sea but the liberated land does not become USA but New York (as in Federal state of New York).
Anyway, it is a good thing that annexed nations are now being able to ressurect. But it is hard to simulate Balkans :D
Please teach AI everything!
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Balthagor
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Re: Italy vs Yugo

Post by Balthagor »

This is reported in the Known Issues thread that Dead nations can revive but there are bugs associated with this feature (new uncapturable nations can spawn).
Chris Latour
BattleGoat Studios
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Zuikaku
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Re: Italy vs Yugo

Post by Zuikaku »

Balthagor wrote:This is reported in the Known Issues thread that Dead nations can revive but there are bugs associated with this feature (new uncapturable nations can spawn).
In my campaign as Japan I've been founding insurgency in Italy in hopes rebels will spawn in Ethiopia and revive it. So far, (after 6 months) have not seen any results. Is founding insurgencies still futile as in SRCW??
Please teach AI everything!
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Balthagor
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Re: Italy vs Yugo

Post by Balthagor »

It is futile in neither program, but if you expect it to do something it doesn't do, you may be disappointed.

It affects the DAR of the other region and some other less critical factors.

DAR will have an effect on the probability of partisans, but is not the only factor.

Funding insurgencies has an indirect connection to partisans, not a direct connection.
Chris Latour
BattleGoat Studios
chris@battlegoat.com
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