Flaws and incorrect things regarding the Dutch game map.

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Emeg
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Flaws and incorrect things regarding the Dutch game map.

Post by Emeg »

Regarding the Netherlands in Supreme Ruler 1936 there are serieus map flaws. In real there is a road existing between the cities Alkmaar and Leeuwarden across the large water inlet IJsselmeer. The Afsluitdijk (Closure Dike) being a causeway built between 1928 and 1932 is a fundamental part of the much larger Zuiderzee Works, and created from the former salt water inlet Zuider Sea the fresh water lake IJsselmeer. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zuiderzee_Works Inside the south-eastern part of the IJsselmeer (Lake IJssel) was between the 1950's and 1970's the largest artifical island in the world, named Flevoland, created were the cities of Lelystad (founded in 1967) and Almere (founded in 1976) are built. Their existence on a SR 1936 scenario map is premature thus unrealistic.

Further, there are no power stations in the cities of Arnhem and Apeldoorn. An important power station in that part of the Netherlands exist in the city of Nijmegen. At a spot very close near the Nijmegen coal power station was during Operation Market Garden (in September 1944) the legendary Waal Crossing action done by troops of the 82nd American Airborne division, using simple paddle boats to cross under heavy German fire the more than 400 meters broad Waal River. Invading the northern river bank in a successful effort taking the northern ramp of the Nijmegen traffic bridge to open the route for the British XXX Army Corps to reach Arnhem. See: http://www.herdenking.nl/nieuw/images/K ... en-Map.jpg

Other important power stations in the Netherlands not present on the game map are located near Breda (the two Amer power stations of Geertuidenberg) For 2020 scenario's and may-be also for Cold War Scenario's the Flevo power station near Lelystad. In Rotterdam and its vicinity are several power stations, the first of the Netherlands you can see above the horizon if you are at the ferryboat from England (Harwich to Hoek of Holland) are the tall chimneys of the Maasvlakte power station. On the north sea coast west of Amsterdam exist the power station of Velzen-IJmuiden, on this spot are not only towns but is a important industrial location too with steel mills. Between Velzen and Haarlem exist in real the North Sea Canal, this broad waterway.. not presented at the game map, [_]O is created to connect the harbors of Amsterdam directly to the North Sea. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Sea_Canal So the on the game map existing sea base for Amsterdam must exist at the North Sea coast at the Velzen spot, not at the Almere spot at the coast of the fresh water inlet Lake IJssel, having in real due the causeway between Alkmaar and Leeuwarden not a connection for the large sea going vessels to the North Sea.

The Velzen-IJmuiden spot was important for the German navy during World War 2, building there a base for their fast motor torpedo boats (E boats) and small submarines too. The German E boats were during daylight hidden, protected in very strong shelters built there, but became active under the cover of the night, attacking allied shipping at the North Sea. Especially after D-Day the German base at Velzen-IJmuiden was considered as a considerable threat to the supply lines serving Allied forces in western Europe and were subjected to repeated air attacks, including attacks against the boat shelters using British Tallboy earthquake bombs.

Another huge [_]O is the not existing sea base at Den Helder, since the Napoleon period up to today being the home base of the Royal Dutch Navy! See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Den_Helder

At Borselle near Vlissingen (Flushing in English) exist a nuclear power station and a coal/biomass power station is there also. At Zwolle is the IJssel power station (burning coal) and at the coast near Delfzijl (north east of Groningen) are the Eems power stations (burning gas) North of Sittard-Geleen and south-west of Venlo exists on the east side of the Maas river the power stations of Maasbracht (burning gas) Another power station in that vicinity is the Swentibold power station at Sittard-Geleen, using heat-power created due industrial processes in a large near-by DSM industry complex. The on the game map existing coal-power stations at Maasticht don't exist in real.

Further of strategic importance for the Netherlands, until the late 1960's, there were coal mines in the Geleen-Sittard and Heerlen area. In Supreme Ruler I miss these mines, built during the first decades of the 20th century and closed about 10 years after the exceptional huge gas reserves were discovered in the Groningen area. The multinational DSM (Dutch State Mines) having its HQ in Geleen-Sittard, was established in 1902 as a state-owned coal mine company. In real there are outside the Dutch wedge between Belgium and Germany no (large) coal reserves, the at the game map incorrect existing coal reserves in the northern part of the Netherlands are in real the huge gas reserves discovered in 1959. These gigantic natural gas fields, being the largest one in Europe and the 10th largest one in the world, should be presented at the game map as very important oil-gas fields.

Regarding the Dutch coal mines: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DSM_(company)
See the Groningen gas fields: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groningen_gas_field

I am missing the important rail-road connection between Amsterdam (via Utrecht and Arnhem) to the German Ruhr area and Cologne. For the later Supreme Ruler scenario's of the 21th century is the railway connection between Rotterdam and the German border south-east of Arnhem just north of the Rhine important. As the Betuwe Route it is a part of the Trans European Transport Network (TEN-T) and built as a railroad link in the TEN-T project 5 between Rotterdam and Genua. For Canadians may-be interesting to mention, the Betuwe Route (in The Netherlands the most costly and controversial railway project built so far) is ending close near the German border at the junction with the railroad between Arnhem and the German border, some meters east of the Ferguson Bridge. This bridge is named after a Canadian lance corporal, killed in action at that location on Easter Monday 1945 during the liberation of my home town.

About the European TEN-T projects, see : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans-Euro ... t_Networks
Regarding the Betuweroute, the Ferguson Bridge, and why the railroad from Arnhem to Germany was for the German Army in World War 2 of strategical importance, see: http://www.12mbdragoons.com/ferguson.html and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betuweroute
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Balthagor
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Re: Flaws and incorrect things regarding the Dutch game map.

Post by Balthagor »

Apologies for not assigning this a ticket before;

Since you mention nuclear, I assume these are corrections for the modern maps?
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Chris Latour
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Balthagor
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Re: Flaws and incorrect things regarding the Dutch game map.

Post by Balthagor »

It seems different comments here relate to different maps. I'll need to know which comments are for which maps.
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MrRipper

Re: Flaws and incorrect things regarding the Dutch game map.

Post by MrRipper »

Well he's posting exact date? Anyway the most important airfield of my exporting country isn't in game; Schiphol! In 2013 the 3rd busiest airfield in europe.

In game this would be an airbase i guess, cause in 1916 it was build for militairy purpose. Although since 1920 after the first world war it was used as civilian airfield.

Location Amsterdam!

edit: Also there is and never was aan airfield in Helmond. There is an Airbase in Eindhoven 1 hex below in the militairy complex. This airfield was the other way, first build as civilian then militairy after the 2nd world war.
geminif4ucorsair
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Re: Flaws and incorrect things regarding the Dutch game map.

Post by geminif4ucorsair »

In addition to these civilian-oriented map changes, there are several military suggestions (naval ships, military production centers, etc.) that are still needed (some of the latter aircraft fabrication and naval fabrication also apply to SR-1949 CW), that are still needed as game changes.
Thanks. :-)
MrRipper

Re: Flaws and incorrect things regarding the Dutch game map.

Post by MrRipper »

bump. Infrastructure has been improved in modern scenarios, but is seems the airfields are a bit messed up in different scenarios. Maybe that was the case before the update, but anyway they are wrong. Also some other facilities still missing.

off topic: Port of Antwerpen (Belgium), one of the biggest in the world, isnt in game.

Should i work this out in excact scenarios and hexes? If so i would like to see this changed in the next patch.
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Balthagor
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Re: Flaws and incorrect things regarding the Dutch game map.

Post by Balthagor »

There is a map errata thread in the support section, please put such data there. And yes, x,y coordinates making fixing things much faster.
Chris Latour
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mrgenie
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Re: Flaws and incorrect things regarding the Dutch game map.

Post by mrgenie »

Emeg wrote:Regarding the Netherlands in Supreme Ruler 1936 there are serieus map flaws. In real there is a road existing between the cities Alkmaar and Leeuwarden across the large water inlet IJsselmeer. The Afsluitdijk (Closure Dike) being a causeway built between 1928 and 1932 is a fundamental part of the much larger Zuiderzee Works, and created from the former salt water inlet Zuider Sea the fresh water lake IJsselmeer. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zuiderzee_Works Inside the south-eastern part of the IJsselmeer (Lake IJssel) was between the 1950's and 1970's the largest artifical island in the world, named Flevoland, created were the cities of Lelystad (founded in 1967) and Almere (founded in 1976) are built. Their existence on a SR 1936 scenario map is premature thus unrealistic.

Further, there are no power stations in the cities of Arnhem and Apeldoorn. An important power station in that part of the Netherlands exist in the city of Nijmegen. At a spot very close near the Nijmegen coal power station was during Operation Market Garden (in September 1944) the legendary Waal Crossing action done by troops of the 82nd American Airborne division, using simple paddle boats to cross under heavy German fire the more than 400 meters broad Waal River. Invading the northern river bank in a successful effort taking the northern ramp of the Nijmegen traffic bridge to open the route for the British XXX Army Corps to reach Arnhem. See: http://www.herdenking.nl/nieuw/images/K ... en-Map.jpg

Other important power stations in the Netherlands not present on the game map are located near Breda (the two Amer power stations of Geertuidenberg) For 2020 scenario's and may-be also for Cold War Scenario's the Flevo power station near Lelystad. In Rotterdam and its vicinity are several power stations, the first of the Netherlands you can see above the horizon if you are at the ferryboat from England (Harwich to Hoek of Holland) are the tall chimneys of the Maasvlakte power station. On the north sea coast west of Amsterdam exist the power station of Velzen-IJmuiden, on this spot are not only towns but is a important industrial location too with steel mills. Between Velzen and Haarlem exist in real the North Sea Canal, this broad waterway.. not presented at the game map, [_]O is created to connect the harbors of Amsterdam directly to the North Sea. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Sea_Canal So the on the game map existing sea base for Amsterdam must exist at the North Sea coast at the Velzen spot, not at the Almere spot at the coast of the fresh water inlet Lake IJssel, having in real due the causeway between Alkmaar and Leeuwarden not a connection for the large sea going vessels to the North Sea.

The Velzen-IJmuiden spot was important for the German navy during World War 2, building there a base for their fast motor torpedo boats (E boats) and small submarines too. The German E boats were during daylight hidden, protected in very strong shelters built there, but became active under the cover of the night, attacking allied shipping at the North Sea. Especially after D-Day the German base at Velzen-IJmuiden was considered as a considerable threat to the supply lines serving Allied forces in western Europe and were subjected to repeated air attacks, including attacks against the boat shelters using British Tallboy earthquake bombs.

Another huge [_]O is the not existing sea base at Den Helder, since the Napoleon period up to today being the home base of the Royal Dutch Navy! See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Den_Helder

At Borselle near Vlissingen (Flushing in English) exist a nuclear power station and a coal/biomass power station is there also. At Zwolle is the IJssel power station (burning coal) and at the coast near Delfzijl (north east of Groningen) are the Eems power stations (burning gas) North of Sittard-Geleen and south-west of Venlo exists on the east side of the Maas river the power stations of Maasbracht (burning gas) Another power station in that vicinity is the Swentibold power station at Sittard-Geleen, using heat-power created due industrial processes in a large near-by DSM industry complex. The on the game map existing coal-power stations at Maasticht don't exist in real.

Further of strategic importance for the Netherlands, until the late 1960's, there were coal mines in the Geleen-Sittard and Heerlen area. In Supreme Ruler I miss these mines, built during the first decades of the 20th century and closed about 10 years after the exceptional huge gas reserves were discovered in the Groningen area. The multinational DSM (Dutch State Mines) having its HQ in Geleen-Sittard, was established in 1902 as a state-owned coal mine company. In real there are outside the Dutch wedge between Belgium and Germany no (large) coal reserves, the at the game map incorrect existing coal reserves in the northern part of the Netherlands are in real the huge gas reserves discovered in 1959. These gigantic natural gas fields, being the largest one in Europe and the 10th largest one in the world, should be presented at the game map as very important oil-gas fields.

Regarding the Dutch coal mines: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DSM_(company)
See the Groningen gas fields: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groningen_gas_field

I am missing the important rail-road connection between Amsterdam (via Utrecht and Arnhem) to the German Ruhr area and Cologne. For the later Supreme Ruler scenario's of the 21th century is the railway connection between Rotterdam and the German border south-east of Arnhem just north of the Rhine important. As the Betuwe Route it is a part of the Trans European Transport Network (TEN-T) and built as a railroad link in the TEN-T project 5 between Rotterdam and Genua. For Canadians may-be interesting to mention, the Betuwe Route (in The Netherlands the most costly and controversial railway project built so far) is ending close near the German border at the junction with the railroad between Arnhem and the German border, some meters east of the Ferguson Bridge. This bridge is named after a Canadian lance corporal, killed in action at that location on Easter Monday 1945 during the liberation of my home town.

About the European TEN-T projects, see : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans-Euro ... t_Networks
Regarding the Betuweroute, the Ferguson Bridge, and why the railroad from Arnhem to Germany was for the German Army in World War 2 of strategical importance, see: http://www.12mbdragoons.com/ferguson.html and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Betuweroute


Funny all your critical points I've fixed in my map. I agree with you 100%, so I took the freedom to rewrite the whole map and fixed all issues in NL..
added Den Helder, etc.. Give everything proper names..
Funny to see I wasn't the only one with these ideas.

But if you want to fix them yourself.. took me less then 10 minutes to fix those mentioned points.. its really easy to edit the map the way you like
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merlinx_at
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Re: Flaws and incorrect things regarding the Dutch game map.

Post by merlinx_at »

Balthagor wrote:There is a map errata thread in the support section, please put such data there. And yes, x,y coordinates making fixing things much faster.

:lol: :lol:
SRU 9.0.73.1 (Steam) / W7Pro-64 eng
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