Feature comparison - Stacking

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Balthagor
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Feature comparison - Stacking

Post by Balthagor »

In discussions about unit HUDs, the question came up of what other games allow for stacking multiple units in the same location and do it well. Opinions?
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Re: Feature comparison - Stacking

Post by Aragos »

Some wargame sims (the ones that copy board wargames) do it somewhat like "counters" (e.g., stack one unit on another, with edges sitting out that you can click to put "on top").


Effectively, Paradox's HOI3 does that as well with Brigades, but puts them into Divisional units (e.g., you can separate out BDE sized units or combined them in a DIV).

IMHO, it seems to me that SR is a mix of the unit stacking limits idea from older wargames and RTS-type unit control.

The question, I think, is whether you want to have a single-stack type of unit (Corps, Army, etc) or stay with stacks of individual units. I think if you stay with stacks, as it is now, that is fine. But if you go to a single-stack concept (whether it is a "big" unit or not), you have to address HQ units, support elements, et al, and then have the ability to combine the separate elements into one unit for play purposes.

Example: SR allows for 7 units. You could have 3 tank, 4 inf and 1 arty unit. Combat is one unit at a time.

A stack would also have 7 units. But, their combat values would be combined, and damage would spread equally to front-line units (trucks and arty only take damage after all inf/arm units are gone). A stack should have greater combat power than individual units (the whole idea of combined arms) but slower speed (harder to move a lot of guys than just 1 person).
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Re: Feature comparison - Stacking

Post by Balthagor »

Thanks, but those suggestions have been made before in other threads. I'm looking to know who's seen stacking done well in other programs. Did you like HoI3's stacking system? I sometimes found it awkward.
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Re: Feature comparison - Stacking

Post by Lea »

Apropos: under The Soviet Field Manual of the mid-20th century, a battalion stands in defensive position of 2-4 sq. km. Offensive position even less: its width can reach just 400 m for decisive direction. With SR's hex a realistic unit should be a corps or even a division (Soviet division's defense frontage 8-12 km, offense - 2-3 km). Modern standards were increased (battalion's defense frontage is 3-5 km and offense 1-2 km), so SR 2020 relatively less unrealistic...

In my opinion, a simple stack is too primitive. In fact an units are combined into the structure like a forest (the concept of graph theory) by some rules (where unit location isn't essential) and units acting generally based on those rules. Unfortunately, it's extremely rare (series of tactical wargames "Steel Panthers").
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Re: Feature comparison - Stacking

Post by Aragos »

Balthagor wrote:Thanks, but those suggestions have been made before in other threads. I'm looking to know who's seen stacking done well in other programs. Did you like HoI3's stacking system? I sometimes found it awkward.
I liked the brigade/division system. It gave the player flexibility to build specialized divisions (ex: playing as the US and building the 101st Airborne with 3xPara brigades, 1xFA brigade, 1xAA brigade; etc.). Instead of 5 units, you had one, which--if you did it correctly--gained bonuses from 'combined arms.' As SR is now, there is no real bonus to having a good mix of units in a stack; you'd be better off with stacks entirely of one type based on terrain (ex: green beret stack in cities, M1 tank stack in the open, etc.)

And honestly, it was to me the only real difference in the game from HOI2.
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Re: Feature comparison - Stacking

Post by GIJoe597 »

I seem to recall really enjoying the way "V For Victory" (360 games circa 1992) handled stacking and Supply. I also really like the way the Hearts of Iron series, specifically III, handles stacking units.

Frontage ( and all that entails, mechanics wise), just "feels" much better than the 7 unit stacking limit and the single unit (albeit a brigade) takes damage at a time in SR.

I am sure there are many more, as I look at my games closet and see the 100's of games there, but nothing springs to mind other than what I typed above at the moment and it is 0337, so. :(
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Re: Feature comparison - Stacking

Post by Snowpig »

Heroes of Might and Magic - "a lot of golden Dragons" = 500-999
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Re: Feature comparison - Stacking

Post by Balthagor »

Thread moved for consideration in future development.
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Re: Feature comparison - Stacking

Post by suaske666 »

Balthagor wrote:Did you like HoI3's stacking system? I sometimes found it awkward.
As someone who has played hundreds of hours of HoI3 I'm of the opinion that stacking is pretty good in that game. sure maybe you could improve it, but it's functional enough, imho.
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