Blue always wins

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Snowpig
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Blue always wins

#1 Post by Snowpig » Jan 11 2013

I have been playing several (8+) sandbox-games throughout the last few patches with following settings:

country: non-USA/USSR

starting units: yes/no
victory condition: complete
normal economy, diplomacy, military,
normal starting ressources
volatility: normal or very high
high approval effects
events: low

No matter what I tried to do, after around 1955-1960 everybody and his dog moved into NATO-Sphere: the "warsaw pact" - countries as well as countries like china, north vietnam or north korea (if survived the korean war)

Just wondering if anybody has seen the map "turn red" in his games (no addons/mods) and by using which settings...

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number47
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Re: Blue always wins

#2 Post by number47 » Jan 11 2013

I confirm this. I was meaning to post the same observation myself. I tried different test games to check this, medium tensions, and high tensions, playing in favour of "blue" or in favour of "red" (but never the sphere leader), played active part in scripted wars, completely ignorred all wars, and no matter what I do I always end up "Blue" as the rest of the world...after some time that USSR is the only country in the red sphere, in the '60 some coup may create another red member but it doesn't last long, couple of years max.

Something is definitivley "fishy" because even when I tried all possible to advance the red sphere (but not playing USSR) I always ended up in the blue sphere around '60s. And when I say "all possible" I mean, no diplomatic contact whatsoever with blue members, no trading with blue members, condeming everything blue members did (I know this has no or close to none aspect on relations but still...), trading activley with red members, assisting red members in scripted wars, etc. and still, slowly but surely I would become first unaligned and then after some time blue :evil:

EDIT: I must emphasise that when speaking of "Blue always wins" I was referring to sphere alignment shift not wars wining.
Last edited by number47 on Jan 13 2013, edited 1 time in total.
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Anthropoid
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Re: Blue always wins

#3 Post by Anthropoid » Jan 11 2013

Does it appear to be specific to Sandbox mod? Is Campaign mode not suffering these issues?

Reason I ask is I'm just starting to get familiarized with the game in a campaign as Blue.

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Re: Blue always wins

#4 Post by Aragos » Jan 11 2013

I've noticed this as well. Part of the problem, I think, has to do with the at-start diplo settings. Blue has a lot more allies or countries that are leaning Blue from the start than Red does. The result, if the AI is running Red, is that Blue dominates automatically over time.

At higher Vol levels (without US intervention) the USSR will send its Merchants out to be wiped out by the UK/French fleets time and time again. The result is a fairly empty USSR later in the game (and it will usually fall to the UK/West even without the USA).

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BigWolf
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Re: Blue always wins

#5 Post by BigWolf » Jan 11 2013

Aragos wrote:At higher Vol levels (without US intervention) the USSR will send its Merchants out to be wiped out by the UK/French fleets time and time again. The result is a fairly empty USSR later in the game (and it will usually fall to the UK/West even without the USA).
I'm noticing this for all AI tbf
Zero Naval escorts, meaning land units travelling via Merchant shipping is simply being wiped out

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Re: Blue always wins

#6 Post by Aragos » Jan 11 2013

Yeah, the game could use a toggle for "Use Merchant Marine" like it now has for diplomatic shipping. Click it and all MM shuts off.

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Re: Blue always wins

#7 Post by Zuikaku » Jan 12 2013

Aragos wrote:Yeah, the game could use a toggle for "Use Merchant Marine" like it now has for diplomatic shipping. Click it and all MM shuts off.
We need patch 4... [_]B
Please teach AI to liberate and colonize instead of only annexing!

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Chesehead
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Re: Blue always wins

#8 Post by Chesehead » Jan 12 2013

What I've noticed is that the Blue advances its sphere more however the Reds have had the majority of the military victories.

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number47
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Re: Blue always wins

#9 Post by number47 » Jan 13 2013

Chesehead wrote:What I've noticed is that the Blue advances its sphere more however the Reds have had the majority of the military victories.
I also was referring to this im my post above...
The sphere "shifting" is bugged somehow. If a country is allied to sphere leader 1, it should not be possible for that country to shift to other sphere (2) and still remain allied to sphere leader 1. :evil:
Also, player country shouldn't shift spheres like AI does, it should have some different rules for player run country to shift spheres. At this moment, player has no influence over which sphere will he belong.
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Anthropoid
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Re: Blue always wins

#10 Post by Anthropoid » Jan 13 2013

Also, player country shouldn't shift spheres like AI does, it should have some different rules for player run country to shift spheres. At this moment, player has no influence over which sphere will he belong.
Not sure if I'm just missing something, but I cannot see how to lean or align either red or blue sphere playing as Egypt. Maybe it is intended to be that way?

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number47
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Re: Blue always wins

#11 Post by number47 » Jan 13 2013

Anthropoid wrote:
Also, player country shouldn't shift spheres like AI does, it should have some different rules for player run country to shift spheres. At this moment, player has no influence over which sphere will he belong.
Not sure if I'm just missing something, but I cannot see how to lean or align either red or blue sphere playing as Egypt. Maybe it is intended to be that way?
Before update 3, trading and signing treaties with certain sphere would push you towards that sphere...now, something is happening with sphere shifting that causses your action to mean nothing and it just forces you to be in the blue sphere no matter what you do...
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PyongYang
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Re: Blue always wins

#12 Post by PyongYang » Jan 13 2013

Watching this thread with interest. I'm now at 1977 with Iraeil, and there's only three reds left, and it's been heavily in favour of the blues for at least a decade. I'm sure before update 3, it would be more evenly matched.

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number47
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Re: Blue always wins

#13 Post by number47 » Jan 13 2013

PyongYang wrote:Watching this thread with interest. I'm now at 1977 with Iraeil, and there's only three reds left, and it's been heavily in favour of the blues for at least a decade. I'm sure before update 3, it would be more evenly matched.
Similar thing happened in either 7.0.1 or 7.2.0 just that everybody was running to red sphere then (instead of blue). :lol: :lol: :lol:
EDIT: found original thread... http://www.bgforums.com/forums/viewtopi ... re#p130895
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Re: Blue always wins

#14 Post by Sawedoff » Jan 14 2013

Interesting. Mine tends to go to Red sphere, but Blue military victories.

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number47
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Re: Blue always wins

#15 Post by number47 » Jan 14 2013

Sawedoff wrote:Interesting. Mine tends to go to Red sphere, but Blue military victories.
Could you give more info on your game? What country are you playing, how active are you in existing wars, is any of the sphere leaders in war with anyone? Game settings, etc....
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