UN problem

[Graygan]

I'm currently playing Brazil, GC, Shattered World, Very high Volatility, Very Hard Military, Hard Economic, Hard Diplo.

My concern... well... not really a concern since I can deal with it easily enough, just observation, I guess... is that the UN REALLY doesn't like it if one of your allies gets taken down. I am/was allied with approximately 90 nations while I built up my economy and research. I had very high UN relations, they were delighted with that bar maxxed out and I had a 98% rating from the UN. Then one of my smaller allies was taken down. A week later a second ally was taken down. A day after that I got an email about my falling UN relations. I went to take a look and the UN was Outraged with me and I was down to a 12% rating. A month later a third allly was taken out and I got booted from the UN.

Umm... Why?

When you have a grand total of 80ish units and the losing allies in question are 10k+ kilometers away, there shouldn't be much of a UN relations hit if one of your allies falls.

[Balthagor]

Anyone else seeing this occur? Don't remember there being such a penalty...

[Hundane]

I had this problem as well on very hard diplomacy but that was sometime before GC came out. See:
http://www.bgforums.com/forums/viewtopi ... 8&start=15

I havent played a very hard diplomacy since.

[Graygan]

I hope I'm not the only one.

Basically, I decided to try my hand at using diplomacy to keep the peace while I build up and it seemed to work. However, after allying with all 50 former US states, 10 or so European nations, 3 African nations, 3 Mid-East Nations, all 3 Oceania nations, and 35 or so Asian nations, it started to get beyond tedious. That's when I stopped my alliance making. Then, of course, on High Volatility everyone went to war with everyone else. Except me. The diplomacy did seem to work that way. Most of S. America had full or almost full bars(likelihood of attack) on me but noone declared war on me while I got busy building up the economy and military. Even after I got booted from the UN, the peace held until I put all 300 land units(tanks, infantry, green berets) and 100 air units(multi fighters/transports) into reserve to try and provoke them into attacking me.

All my current alliances seemed to take minor hits when my allies fell. Is your UN standing based upon the ups/downs of your allies? If so, that might explain it. With such a high number of allies, when they all lose a bit in the diplo bar, that would add up.

It's not that big a deal to be booted out of the UN since I've kept my allies and they are still active(the more important ones anyways) with full or nearly full diplo bars, but it was a bit surprising to be booted out of the UN that fast for doing literally nothing.

[Graygan]

Been playing around with it some in some side games...

It appears that what's happening is that when an ally falls, you are getting hit with negative UN feelings because of the broken agreements. When you have a full ally who likes you and you break your full alliance and all other agreements you have with them, you get nailed by bad feelings from the UN. The only difference is that when you do it on purpose you also lose treaty rating %. Whereas when an ally falls, you don't. So I'm not sure if that's it. Either way, it's a rather serious hit. Granted, it's got little real effect on your nation and doesn't seem to affect your other current ally feelings, but it's still something that doesn't seem right.

[Balthagor]

You sure that's what's occurring? Anyone else seeing this?

[Graygan]

You sure that's what's occurring? Anyone else seeing this?

No, I'm not completely sure, but it's the only thing that really makes sense unless there's some other process for determining UN relations when a nation falls. I took pictures from my current game. Allied with Israel and when they fell, I took a big hit.

First picture to show my relations after alliances... The subsidy went up a bit after that, to around 79%

UNStatus1.jpg

Second picture shows what happened immediately after my ally Israel fell...

UNStatus2.jpg

Third picture shows that even 4 or 5 months later the relations are still recovering...

UNStatus3.jpg

During that whole time, my personal relations with everyone in the world were pretty good. Even now, years later in-game, I can still get a variety of treaties with just about anyone if I decided I wanted to. I've not built up the armed forces very much, I have few active units. I've not gone to war. I've not done anything hostile, which is why the world likes me at the moment. Obviously that will change later on, but at the moment that's it.

A month before Israel fell, its war with Syria was at a stalemate with half of Israel gone and had been that way for months. I figured, since I'd finally gotten my economy self-sufficient, I would send an aid package to see if that'd help them. I sent roughly 81 billion in goods and cash. Then Syria crushed them in 1 month and I got nailed with the bad UN relations. The death of Israel had no obvious effects with my relations to anyone else in the world, but the UN didn't like it.

[Balthagor]

Can you zip and send me the savegame from before Israel fell? Send it to Chris@battlegoat.com and include the following;

http://www.bgforums.com/forums/viewtopi ... ead#unread

[madjack]

this happens to me too. happens to the AI too, when their friends fall.

also, when you break alliances there's no chance for the former ally to attack you. CB rises up to maximum, but chance to attack, a big zero. happened on multiple instances with different countries. those ex allies seem to always have 0% chance to attack you when all the world has 100%. check please..

[Graygan]

Can you zip and send me the savegame from before Israel fell? Send it to Chris@battlegoat.com and include the following;

http://www.bgforums.com/forums/viewtopi ... ead#unread

I've saved over it by now. That's my current game that I'm doing for an AAR. I'll start up a new game and force the issue and send the saved game for that one. Probably later tonight when I have time to do it.

[madjack]

I started another (hopefully more accurate) thread about this topic..