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 Post subject: Left double click on map should...
PostPosted: Jun 17 2008 
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Joined: May 04 2008
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Location: Munich
put you to Land -> Complex details. I know you can right click, but since doubleclick does not seem to be used, it would be a nice addition.

Maybe someone else has an idea what would be more valuable.


Also when right-clicking on the map to scroll, it selects the country right below the cursor, which sometimes is unintended by me. :-) Holding the right mouse button shouldnt do that, if possible.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jun 17 2008 
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Supreme Ruler

Joined: Jun 04 2002
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Location: BattleGoat Studios
If you don't want it to select the region, use the center mouse button (or push down your scroll wheel) to move the map.

Also, if you mouse has more than 3 buttons you may find one of them is/can be mapped to the Ctrl+right click function.

I'll pass along the suggestion but I think that is a very unintuitive action for a double click. But that's just me...

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jun 17 2008 
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Joined: May 04 2008
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Location: Munich
Thanks for the info. Forgot bout my middle mouse button. :D


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jun 17 2008 
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Joined: Aug 27 2007
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Location: Austria
I actually agree with UsF. In most every application or game, left double click opens the item. Dk on a unit should select the unit on top (or rather the whole stack), dk on a complex should bring up the details.
When I first played the demo, I thought my mouse was broken, because I was trying to dk everywhere, but nothing would happen. Dk is much more intuitive than having to pick basic commands from a scrolling list.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jun 17 2008 
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Apollon wrote:
...In most every application or game, left double click opens the item...

But we don't have anything to "open up", there are no popups for buildings and the unit popup is about the "design" not the actual unit.

I'm not saying no, just that I'm not sure is all.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jun 17 2008 
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Joined: Aug 27 2007
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Location: Austria
It doesn't have to open the unit stats. Just selecting the unit, so you can give it orders, would be nice. That would be much more intuitive than having to click on the hex, then moving the mouse and clicking the unit's name one the list (which feels especially strange when there is only one unit to choose from).
And when there are several units on the hex, the whole stack becomes selected (or "activated").

When you dk on a hex that contains a complex but no unit, then the complex details would appear (as UsF said).
Same for a hex that contains nothing (so you can build something without going through all the menus).

When there's a unit and a complex present, only the unit gets selected.

I'm sure, there could be even more uses for doubleclicks. Most every software and game that I know of, applies this principe: When you click on something, something gets selected. When you doubleclick on something, either even more gets selected, or something happens. When you right click on something, either a menu, or general info comes up.
There's just too many instances in 2020, where clicking on stuff doesn't do anything at all. In the defense interface, for example, where all you units are listed by deployed and reserves, it should't be necessary to push a separate "add to selected units" button, just to select a unit (which, to make it even more cumbersome, makes the list disappear, and your having to click through the menu again). Simply clicking on the unit in the list should select it. I'm sure that's what 99% of all players would expect. Shift-clicking should add it to the pool of already selected units (it works this way in most other pieces of software).

The truth is that, while the interface has been immensely streamlined, compared to 2010, and it also does look very nice, many things that one would expect to be possible with single or double clicks, or by pushing a button that is readily accessible, in 2020 involve numerous mouse operations. In fact, the amount of scrolling through lists and menus necessary has actually increased, compared to 2010, because they all now have to fit in that small box.
The most striking example is the unit order list. This one, of all things, ideally shouldn't involve scrolling, at all. One possible solution to this would be to remove the name of the order and only leave the symbol. That way, there would be room to arrange the symbols in several parallel columns, instead of a single one. That would eliminate the scroll bar, while players would still be able to tell the symbols apart (other games use symbols, too). When in doubt, there could always appear tooltip, telling the symbol's function, when you mouse over it. Having a keyboard command for every unit order would do the same, without the need of redesigning the interface.
Finding a country in the diplomacy interface, is another one. The scrolling involved is simply immense, despite the regions being grouped by continent. Having the list expand vertically, so it fills the entire height of the screen (but not horizontally), would alleviate this greatly.
Same goes for the list of facilities. Presently, they're all lumped together, sorted not by type, but by complex. It's simply not useful like that. The icons are too small, the list too huge, the listing too obscure (if they were at least ordered by type, that would help a little). Bringing back the large facility overview window from 2010, with its tabs and nice large icons and fonts, that would be excellent.

Please excuse my long rant, but this pretty much sums up the total of my peeves with SR2020. I vented my steam now, and I promise, I won't be nagging any more in the future. :)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Jun 18 2008 
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Location: Ancaster, Ontario - BattleGoat Studios
I hope to offer you a few tips that may help with some of what you are talking about.

tip1) Early in development when we were asked about having every country in the game we wondered about the long list of countries. Yes, putting them into continents helped a bit but I made a suggestion that actually works. This suggestion for the most part makes the country list not needed. >>> Left click or right click, on the map, and the county in the list changes to the map selection. If you want to review a particular item, such as the enemies and allies sub department/panel. Open "STATE", open "Conflict & Support" then click around the map. You'll see the country of focus change and you can review each one's enemies and allies. Does this help?

tip 2) if you want to build, you can also do it in each department, that has associated facilities. Sub-department button 4: "Facilities". Even in the "PRODUCTION" department this list is filtered by the first panel 'resource list'. Does this help?

tip 3) pick units and then right click the map. a menu appears with orders that are sensitive or filtered to that location and for the unit selection you made. It doesn't offer all orders but it does offer most of the commonly used ones. Does this help?

tip 4) try what Balthagor(Chris) mentioned already. CTRL+RIGHT CLICK a hex. opens land department. This opens "military presence" if units in hex. If no units... it will open the "complex details"


As for the Unit Command list - I believe we are going to continue to make improvements in this area (as well as others).

Let us know if my "tips" worked out ok.


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