Harder AI desperatly needed, don't care if it cheats!

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bergsjaeger
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Post by bergsjaeger »

:lol: Try playing as Quatar once in the Middle East Scenario. Now that's a challenge. That's who I was when the Saudis attacked me.
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Post by BigStone »

[quote="bergsjaeger] That's who I was when the Saudis attacked me.[/quote]

And... did you survived it... :lol:
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Journier
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Post by Journier »

ever played macedonia?

that gets crazy fast, 2 front war = you die :) your country is the size of a peanut, and you gotta find the money to buy new industries (oil), after that you may or may not have the economy to build up your military to fend off the northern country and the country to the west of you.

the northern nation (forget the name of) sends a literal stream of tanks at you which seems to break your relatively small army in no time, and the more you retreat the more population you lose (i think they have 2 million population maybe)

and if you lose too much population :) you cant get new units to the front lines since you dont have the population to draw from! heh :)

but what i mean is the ai i wish could handle larger scenario's better :) and more even circumstances
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bergsjaeger
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Post by bergsjaeger »

:lol: yep I was Quatar. Anti-tanks back by arty and infantry in emplacements does wonders. I seen something tonite that was rather funny. It was in the US West scenario. California and South West went to war. They battled over the same river for nearly a year. the death toll between them was over 200K. i counted at one time over 18 tank battalions from Califorina take on one bradley battalion because it took some of California's land. :lol: course I helped them both kill one another a little. Its amazing how much hardware an Ai will go through if u give it to them. I guess i should have sold it to them instead. But I did get something out of it. While the 2 regions were killing one another I watched the equipment I loaned to the regions. I guess it was kinda a testing ground for me. Now I know what not to use aganist about 40 arty pieces while I cross a river. Too bad the AI didn't learn anything because they did it several times. In one try California lost over 10k men. But there is something annoying going on in the war. There is an airbase in SW that has been take over and retaken over I counted 16 times. U would think one of them can hold the base but seems I helped them both too much. If I go to war with either of them that airbase is the first thing on my target list. Seems I'm enjoying wiping bases off the map with airstrikes to much but its fun doing. :D
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bergsjaeger
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Post by bergsjaeger »

well tonite I seen a rather scary AI while I was playing the Russian scenario. It got me nervous for a little while. I never seen some may AI units coming at me. I counted one time over 20 units coming to attack just one spot and most of them were tanks. Now that's a massive attack. And there were spots all across my line like that. What saved me was I had infantry entrenched on my border and air sorties. My attack bombers racked up on a alot of kills but I lost alot of the A/B squads too. I think the AI is pretty good now. I think it comes down to how many units the AI has. If they have alot then they will use more of them. As in my case tonite. I just don't want another fight like that for awhile. finger's cramping from all the clicking. :D
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bergsjaeger
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Post by bergsjaeger »

Yep I somewhat comfirmed it. The Ai will use massive assaults if they have alot units to spare ( I mean alot this region had over 500 battalions at one time in the field half of them were tanks.) Because I didn't see anymore attacks like the one last nite because I either killed most of them or in repair. I know alot were in repair because I switched to the region to see. I later took over the region with almost no trouble at all. Due to there not being alot of units in fighting condition.
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Journier
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Post by Journier »

if your playing on the world scenario the ai just doesnt seem to handle it very well.

for example, i am watching Europe and russia attack each other right now (both are my allies)

europe could steam roll russia, if europe took all the mechanised infantry away from its cities and sent them into russia, instead they sit there babysitting every city they control very far away from the front line..
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Post by margab »

Journier wrote:if your playing on the world scenario the ai just doesnt seem to handle it very well.

for example, i am watching Europe and russia attack each other right now (both are my allies)

europe could steam roll russia, if europe took all the mechanised infantry away from its cities and sent them into russia, instead they sit there babysitting every city they control very far away from the front line..
That seems to be one of the most basic problems the ai is having in my games too. As I've indicated in other posts also, the ai should understand that, cities that are too behind the front lines have a very minimum chance of being attacked (this can be done by assigning weights to if they should garrison a city or not?) and should take units from these cities and pump them to front lines for a more effective assault/defence (for scenarios where there is world market, the ai should undertand that it won't get attacked by the WM and take all units bordering WM up to the front lines).
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bergsjaeger
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Post by bergsjaeger »

If an AI sent all its units to the front I bet I being using alot more airborne troops. It be too easy to take towns when there no units were there to protect them. If Oz ever comes back on here let him tell u what happens when u send everything to the front and not protect the rear.
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Post by Journier »

? im just talking the main mobile attack forces, I am not talking about taking all the garrisons etc from the cities.

it would be great if the AI would just take all the units meant for offensive use and brought them toward the front lines :)

and if this would be implemented im sure one of the dev's would figure out how to tell the AI to keep a small "mobile" defense force, running around in its interior, if indeed someone tried a air/sea assault near one of its cities.
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Post by tkobo »

I'm all for the AI thinking and therefore staging ,less defensively.

The AI does not use enough of it units,because it ties too many of them up in garrison duty all around its region.

It also doesnt build what to me is a correct ratio of units.It builds far too much anti-air and supply units, no where near enough infrantry and tanks.

There is however a problem IF too many units are sent into combat by the AI's at one time.Its a large performance hit in how well the game runs.

Theres a thread that explains this performance hit very in detail somewhere on the board, but since search is currently flaky,i cant currently point to it .
This post approved by Tkobo:Official Rabble Rouser of the United Yahoos
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Post by bayern20 »

I think an issue can be that when building the AI, the programmers try to make it look and feel as much as a real country as they can. And lets face it, real countries are safe, boring, and do not do extreme things.
As players of this game however, we usually do crazy things.

The problem is, that it receives no response from other nations.

I think its probably been improved with the updates, but more can be done.
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Post by margab »

bayern20 wrote:I think an issue can be that when building the AI, the programmers try to make it look and feel as much as a real country as they can. And lets face it, real countries are safe, boring, and do not do extreme things.
As players of this game however, we usually do crazy things.

The problem is, that it receives no response from other nations.

I think its probably been improved with the updates, but more can be done.
You might be right, but in this game nations have to be crazy, since it's not a casual war, this is a war of annihilation. Nations need to go out on full offensives if needed. Right now, if the AI country doesn't have enough troops to garrison all the cities, bridges etc. they don't go on offensives that much, which doesn't make sense (especially putting units in cities that only border WM).

I also have two questions:

1) I think the answer to the first one is obvious, but does the AI ever build anything? I mean any buildings. I'm just wondering about this.

2) The other question is that does the AI ever use planes and/or ships for offensive measures? Or do they just sit in their country waiting to be destroyed by the human player?
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tkobo
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Post by tkobo »

1) Not yet. Many issues about how well the AI would handle this and how easily the AI could cause itself more problems by building than not.
Devs have stated its something they are working on.

2) Yes, they do. Just not as often as they should and not as coordinated as they should.
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Post by Leafgreen »

Hate to say it, but Hearts of Iron II does have an AI that can easily blunt, counter-attack and decimate attacks against it. You might be invading the Soviet Union with 400 elite uber units, but they have 1000 infantry divisions - and with much less upkeep so THEY have a positive economy.

But SR has more potential, has cooler/more sprites, more options for micromanaging units (while not being mandatory), adds base/industry/supply/ROE and dozens of other ideas that enhance the game, and their devs don't bite your head off.

What about unit upkeep costs? One way that may help balance the difference between gauss rifle tanks vs garrisons and mortars may be to raise the upkeep costs substantially for elite and modern units.
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