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I think the balance of ship vs heavy bomber needs a large rebalance.

My thoughts on this are simple.A single heavy bomber unit- say a B-52H consists of multiple aircraft.
A ship only one ship.

Currently a ship, even a small ship like a patrol boat can survive multiple attacks by mulitple units of heavy bombers.

So lets say the heavy bomber unit consists of 17 heavy bombers.
And lets say 4 units of heavy bombers attack a ship.

Is it really resaonable that that ship would survive even one attack by 17 heavy bombers- let alone 68 such aircraft- let alone survive multiple attacks by that number of aircraft ?

Currently its takes a very large amount of heavy bombers to destroy a single ship, even one that cant attack back.

Now ive not done any research on this, but i currently find it hard to believe a single ship would survive being carpet bombed by a single b-52h, let alone 17, let alone 68, etc...

Something perhaps to be looked at for sr2020.

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This post approved by Tkobo:Official Rabble Rouser of the United Yahoos
Chuckle TM

tkobo,

In some sense, history disagrees with you.

In WWII, high level bombers were tried against surface ships on several occasions with uniformily dismal results. Dropping iron bombs on a static target is a game of probabilities and statistics -- when the target is moving the chance of a direct hit decreases exponentially. A CEP for B-52 with iron bombs is still measured in miles. Basically, you have to be damn lucky to hit a moving ship from a high level bomber using dumb bombs.

Since WWII high level bombers have gotten better -- but so have ships. I would consider it a push -- with neither having a marginal gain of superiority over the last 60 years (e.g., gains in bombers and ships cancel each other out, relatively, a high level bomber is as effective against a ship as it was in WWII).

Regards,
Feltan

I'll go with Feltan in this one...

_________________
Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent.
Isaac Asimov, Salvor Hardin in "Foundation"
-
Si vis pacem, para bellum
-
It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere.
Voltaire

Ill have to do some research i guess, but ww2 is not a good example.

B-52s can now drop iron bombs with kits that make them lesser satellite guided smart bombs.

In addition last year, a project was started to place strategic rotary launchers in the bomb bay of a B-52 bombers,which would allow the ability to add conventional smart bombs in the bay to the B52s normal load.

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This post approved by Tkobo:Official Rabble Rouser of the United Yahoos
Chuckle TM

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m ... i_77106296

http://www.spacewar.com/reports/Boeing_ ... 2_999.html

http://www.strategypage.com/dls/articles/2004522a.asp

Thats gives some info on the non-iron bombs.

Ill look and see if theres any info on current heavy bombers using iron bombs vs ships.

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This post approved by Tkobo:Official Rabble Rouser of the United Yahoos
Chuckle TM

Aren't smart bombs modeled as missiles in SR2010? And the stats of heavy bombers reflects a loadout of iron dumb bombs?

Another question.... Are GPS guided bombs effective against targets in movement?

Unfortunatelly I can think of any other example were heavy bombers were used against ships in high seas....

_________________
Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent.
Isaac Asimov, Salvor Hardin in "Foundation"
-
Si vis pacem, para bellum
-
It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere.
Voltaire

http://www.ussschenectadylst1185.org/3- ... ntFury.htm

Heres a perfect example, at least for the jdam.

And no, i dont believe the jdam is modeled in the game as its range is too short.

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This post approved by Tkobo:Official Rabble Rouser of the United Yahoos
Chuckle TM

Good link...It made me a convert...

So it is either modeling it as a guide missile or increasing the stats....

_________________
Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent.
Isaac Asimov, Salvor Hardin in "Foundation"
-
Si vis pacem, para bellum
-
It is hard to free fools from the chains they revere.
Voltaire

Hhahhaha, cant find a single article on carpet bombing ships .

Man,if i was in charge of someones airforce, id order just such a test just for blanks and giggles.

Guess ill keep looking.

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This post approved by Tkobo:Official Rabble Rouser of the United Yahoos
Chuckle TM

tkobo,

If you introduce smart weapons into the equation, things will change. Like Draken, I was under the impression the native attack value of strategic bombers (as modelled in 2010) was based on a load of dumb bombs.

Regards,
Feltan

That is correct, although it is true that we don't model JDAM directly



That matches what I remember of this issue when we discussed it in house. We used WWII as an example so right or wrong it set the standard. This sort of thing will come up again in the Beta for SR2020 I'm sure. Might start a "tracking" thread for things that will need to be tested in the beta with links to the appropriate threads, but not tonight.

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Chris Latour
BattleGoat Studios
chris@battlegoat.com

I really cant believe no modern air force has looked at iron bombs delivered by heavy bombers against ships.
Its makes no sense.
They still do training and tests with iron bombs for the smaller fighter bomber aircraft against ships.

And the things is, the jdam is really a kit.The bomb it goes on is an iron bomb.The bomb itself doesnt actually change.So technically its still dropping iron bombs.

I guess this will be my search of month issue, til i find something or give up.

Also something to keep in mind when looking at this in the future, I dont think some smaller missiles are taken into account either,like the hellfire or maverick.

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This post approved by Tkobo:Official Rabble Rouser of the United Yahoos
Chuckle TM

Hellfire and Maverick are definitly considered part of the unit loadout, Maverick gives the 24km range to most fighters, but I'm still lacking data on effectiveness against ships...

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Chris Latour
BattleGoat Studios
chris@battlegoat.com

I think i can get info on that.IF i remember correctly, the SINK-EX tests incorporated hellfire and maverick missiles against ships.

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This post approved by Tkobo:Official Rabble Rouser of the United Yahoos
Chuckle TM

http://sinkex.uss-buchanan-ddg14.org/

One for the hellfire,which says 3 hellfire hits failed to sink the ship,despite the ship already having been hit by other weapons.

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This post approved by Tkobo:Official Rabble Rouser of the United Yahoos
Chuckle TM