Missile Defense?

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IBK02
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Post by IBK02 »

In my search both on the website and in this forum, i am yet to find any information on missile defense. Will the Arrow be available in Israel? Will the Patriot be available in western nations? How about Russian and Chinese theatre based missile defense? Is there even a need for these defensive systems?

Has the "THEL"(Tactical High Energy Laser) been considered? This should be in use in Israel and the United States by no later then 2005.

How about global missile defense? Would Star Wars, Son of Star Wars, or the new proposed missile defense be appropriate in the game, or is it involved?
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Balthagor
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Post by Balthagor »

Q. Will the Arrow be available in Israel? Will the Patriot be available in western nations? How about Russian and Chinese theatre based missile defense?
A. Patriots are already tested in the game and the Russian/Chinese stuff is in the list, just haven't tried them. The reason you had a hard time finding it is that we deal with these types of missiles as units carried by their launch vehicles. So a Scud launcher fires a scud, the patriot, as an anti air unit, fires on the missile. In general, any missiles that would be engaged in flight in the real world is handled as a unit with extreme speed and no range (impact for dmg)

Q. Has the "THEL"(Tactical High Energy Laser) been considered?
A. Already listed in the research tree but some of the details are not decided yet. Think I had it ~2007 though. I did catch the news about it last month.

Q. How about global missile defense?
A. I'll get David to answer this one...
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Juergen
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Post by Juergen »

Id like to ask a question regarding cruise missiles:

As far as I have heard from another post the game pauses automatically if a player (AI) launches nukes.
In case ICBMs would be launched that would make sense since their launch can easily be detected.
But would the game also pause if a nuclear cruise missile had been launched?

The point of a such a missile is that it is only detected if it is already too late and if the game pauses a human player would be warned.
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tkobo
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Post by tkobo »

I missed this.The game pauses when nukes are launched ?

Before I say anything else,let me say I like this feature and would like it in game.

BUT,it does have a small drawback.It kinda eliminates the suspense of wether or not the missile heading at your region is indeed a nuke.
As the pause would give it away.

In harpoon any missile launch caused the game to pause and the player had to identify the incoming missiles(or wait for the ai to do it for him).
Will we know automactically in game what type of missile is launched ?Even if we can't see it yet ?
I kinda like the idea of a "suprise" nuke attack on the smaller maps where the target really wont have time to waste trying to see what warhead its carrying.
It adds tension and suspense to the situation.
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BattleGoat
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Post by BattleGoat »

Geez... The questions got harder the further I read :smile:

Yes, eventually you will be able to research and deploy Star Wars systems. It likely won't be even available as a research item though until you reach the "World" or final scenario in the campaign.

The "Pause" was based on ICBM's. I'll have to think about Cruise Missiles. I think that since we are forcing them to be smaller yields and there is likely to be more of them, there won't be the pause.
- David
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Post by Juergen »

Why do you "force" the cruise missiles to have smaller yields?

In real life these missiles have a yield around 200-350 Kilotons.
How much Kt do you want them to have and why?

I dont see a reason to make them less dangerous than they are in RL.

I think that if a player gets surprised by them its his fault that he didnt invest in some good AWACS planes.

In my opinion the whole point of "stop the game when the nukes are flying" is that a player isnt surprised because things happen to fast and still has some actions left.
The really important question is under what conditions should the game pause and what kind of actions the player can perform.

It makes sense to stop the game as soon as an ICBM launch is DETECTED.
Because of the missiles flight path and their size they are usually easy to detect.
And besides ICBM silos are known locations that will be checked by satellites regularly.
Spotting such a launch shouldnt be too much trouble.

The same should be true if an cruise missile launch would have been detected.
Of course it is far more difficult to detect these kind of missiles in flight so there should be very little warning before impact.
And yes it might very likely happen (I even hope that this can happen) that a player only sees the impact.
And in case this cruise missile had a nuclear warhead...tough luck the player should have been more watchfull.

If there is a launch (ICBM,SLBM or cruise missile) but the player cant detect it then then the game should only pause if there has been an impact and a nuclear explosion.
A nuclear explosion anywhere is a good reason to pause the game I think :wink:

But if the game simply pauses as soon as someone launches his ICBMs then a human player may take that as a warning.
And if he didnt buy himself equipment to detect these lanches then I think he clearly doesnt deserve that warning.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Juergen on 2003-03-06 11:27 ]</font>
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tkobo
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Post by tkobo »

When I say "suprise nuke attack" I dont mean they are suprised missiles were launched.
I mean that they have no way to tell in time that the missiles launched ARE nukes and not just conventional.

I'm assuming that the way air detection works based on the radar thread that a region will know of any missile entering its territory automatically.
What i'm asking is that the missiles are not automactically known to be a certain payload type.
So that upon seeing the missile the player has to make a decision about his reaction to it.Is it a nuke ? Should I unload my nukes on the foe ?Or is it conventional and not warrant a nuke strike by me in return ?

The pause at this point would be to let the player think out his options and make a choice based on what he knows/thinks,while making him sweat out not knowing til the missile impacts whether or not he made the right choice.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: tkobo on 2003-03-06 11:46 ]</font>
IBK02
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Post by IBK02 »

I suspect that there is more important information associated with the "pause" factor. I hope that this aspect of the game does not take away from the vitality of early warning systems and advanced communications. Furthermore, i dont think that advanced delivery systems should be compromised. Whats the point in having an advanced blue water navy with Nuclear Subs equiped with strategic weapons if any old shmuck can see the game pause, search, and react devoid of capabilities.

This is what i meant by more important information. The fact that there will most likely be a response to this message elaborating on the ideas portrayed above.
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Balthagor
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Post by Balthagor »

Sorry if we are a little quiet on this one but I don't want to comment on how missiles work in the game until missiles work in the game. I've been collecting all the information and once the missiles are flying I will try and give an accurate recounting of how missile combat happens and so far I don't see any problems with most of the details people are asking for. I'll get back to you on this... feel free to keep discussing it though...
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tkobo
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Post by tkobo »

Any new info on this ?
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BattleGoat
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Post by BattleGoat »

Still being tweaked. We'll comment on this when it is finished, but it should make everyone happy...
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tkobo
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Post by tkobo »

Yea, tea, another old thread im curious about.
Any news ?
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