BGForums

Just wondering about a few things:

1. What is the mechanism for calculating civilian caualties? In a WWIII scenario as the U.S., I was amused/shocked to see in excess of 1,000,000 Mexican civilian casualties -- and the U.S. forces weren't doing anything henious like carpet bombing urban areas. In general, the numbers generated seem high.

2. Do the numbers mean anything? Do they impact civrel/diprel with other nations? I did note, perhaps coincidently, that several nations DOW'd me in short order after the peak of civilian causalties.

3. If the numbers mean anything (other than window dressing), how does one go about controlling the casualties generated?

TIA,
Feltan

K, im not going to number responses as i am not sure what your asking (especially for number one).

However, one reason civ casulties are so high is that there is a lot of art use.
Most hexs have a civ. pop.Firing at a unit in a hex that has a civ. pop. with art will cause civ. casulties.This is extremely punishing to civs when the hex is highly populated ,like a city(or faciltiy).

I "think" it was said a while back, that civ kills had a small effect on diplo ratings.

Not sure it it has any other effect.In order to control the number of civs you kill, scale back and even stop using any unit that attacks a hex or facility.
This means limit art use, limit missile use, limit bomber use,limit some naval use,etc...

A while ago, i tried to play a game out in which i limited the deaths of my own civs.It was pretty impossible.

Unless you fight like the Russians, there's nothing you can realistically do to minimize it. Don't worry about it...

and maybe the casualties are so high because BG never implemented an immigration/emmigration model for individual hexes.

In the case of war we often see entire populations deported or leaving from area's where the major battles are fought, to return later and rebuild. You can't fight an urban war if u can't destroy the buildings with people in it...there's bound to be massive collateral damage if people don't leave

Killing civilians also decreases your World Market Rating, as far as I know.
But not important in world scenario

IMO this should also be discussed in 2020's forum as it's got room for development and tweaking.

Long time no see. Been gone awhile. Anyways. What's wrong with killing a few million people. I stride to do such a lot of the time. Matter fact in on scenario I left only one city standing on the map. The region didn't have anything else left. Everything was destroyed with F/B's.

LOL Berg

Feltan,
I have encountered the same thing in Mexico. Were you by any chance assaulting Mexico City? I believe it is a ratio based on the population densities of cities. They have enormous dense slums surrounding quite a few of them and the casualty numbers become inflated because of this. I haven't played in China or SE Asia much, but I imagine the same sort of effect would occur. I've seen them in person in Mexican border towns, and people live in literal piles of rubbish. Armored vehicles could cause massive civilian casualties just by driving over what they thought was a trash dump.

Who cares? Humans are replaceable and cities can be rebuilt.

Humans are replaceable and cities can be rebuilt

If cities are destroyed they cannot be rebuilt.

I'll check it out for myself, but has anyone double checked to see if the actual population numbers on city hexes go down when you bombard units in them? Or for that matter, go up when you have an immigration boom?

Yes,checked many times.Yes they do go down.

and

Yes they do go up.

I alter my global rules of engagement to remove facilites as targets.

To me this means that my units will target Units in cities, but not the cities (and civilians) themselves.

When I want my bombers to attack a facility, I specially set their ROE to include facilities.

I think that the indescriminate use of "area effect" missiles could contribute to civ casulties too. I never deliberately manufacture them.