PC Gamer

deanco · Post by **deanco** » Jul 20 2005

I have no access to the original article, but judging from the quotes:

1) I'm sure the author dreams of writing for Salon.com one day.

2) The author played the game for a short while, and jumped to the conclusion that the game was boring. (To be fair, I jump to those kinds of conclusions with demos quite often. The difference is, I'm not reviewing the game, I'm a consumer. If I miss out on a good game because of this jumping to conclusion, it's either my fault for not giving the game enough of a chance, or the dev's fault for not making the game attractive enough. But no baby seals died as a result of my decision.)

3) Once this conclusion was reached, the author was happy. You see, negative reviews are much more fun (and easier) to write than positive reviews. He gets the chance to get the machete out and hack and slash the game to bits, armed with his thesarus, so he can show everybody not how bad the game is, but how witty he is, and how much he *really* deserves to be writing for Salon.

DeanCo--

yakaspat · Post by **yakaspat** » Jul 20 2005

What the hell?

Now I know why I never read PC Gamer....stick with Computer Gaming World.

I reviewed this game at gamespot.com and gave it a 9.5 out of 10. Anything less than that is unreasonable. My guess is this guy plays the likes of C&C Generals, Dawn of War, and Doom3 and wouldn't know a good "stragedy" game if it bit him in the ass. I think I'll say exactly that in my email to their editor!

el_slapper · Post by **el_slapper** » Jul 20 2005

Bah - journalists. They happen to hit the nail, but they're often out of order. Their job seems to be speaking of what they don't know.

The 14th of July is the national day in France. I just watched the troops marching in the Champs-ElysÃ©es on TV. I used to be conscript on the 27th alpine - I know the unit. They were marching. The journalist did present them in 1 sentence - with 3 big errors in the sentence

.....

Of course, my own example is not important - who really cares whether troops are really marching with combat uniforms or parade uniforms? But when it comes to more important issues(and testing products has a huge economical impact), the same level of errors remains. And you have a lot of problems over there.....

I'll buy SR2010 once it will reach France's shops because the demo was suiting my tastes. Bar none. I was advised it by (other)forum members, but trusted noone. Only testing made me know it was worth it. Journalists? Erk, most of them don't even know the difference between a tank & an APC - even when commenting a military parade or testing a militaristic video game

limbo696 · Post by **limbo696** » Jul 20 2005

While I have not read the review, the rating is ridiculously low given that this game is so much deeper than your typical strategy game. For example, I became convinced to buy the game when I saw the economic discussions on the board--here was a game that could actually teach me something about real life economics!

However, I do understand the reviewer's frustration in learning the game. As I stated in a previous post, the learning curve for this game is the steepest I've ever seen, and I feel that more effort should have been put forth by the developers to provide a more interactive set of tutorials, more detailed and up-to-date documentation, and plenty of very simple missions that focus on different aspects of the game (i.e., production, military, economics, etc.) Had these learning tools been provided, the reviewer probably would not have given up on the game so quickly. Last, I too always find myself battling against the interface to accomplish tasks so I can't disagree with the reviewer here. (Admittedly, I'm a human factors type guy that is very sensitive to this issue.)

I am very tempted to write to PC Gamer given that I've been a long time subscriber.

deanco wrote: 1) I'm sure the author dreams of writing for Salon.com one day.
DeanCo--

And your point is what--That liberals are stupid? As a frequent reader of Salon.com, I find their articles to be thoughtful and well written. I suggest you solely assign "liberal" ministers to your cabinet positions and watch your country flourish!

Seriously, this is yet another variable that you could examine in this wonderfully deep game and simulation--truly amazing! Keep up the great work!

Moritz · Post by **Moritz** » Jul 20 2005

Why did they put him to review that game ?? Isn't Mark H. Walker the "specialist" on wargames ? Why didn't he review it? ? I thought that PC Gamer was going to be giving a 70%.

deanco · Post by **deanco** » Jul 20 2005

limbo696 wrote:
deanco wrote: 1) I'm sure the author dreams of writing for Salon.com one day.
DeanCo--
And your point is what--That liberals are stupid?

Not at all. My point is Salon = widely read, respected, intellectual online journal, whereas PC Gamer (US) = niche market rag read mainly by 14 year olds. If it makes you feel any better, you can substitute 'New Republic' for 'Salon'.

The meaning of my post stays the same.

DeanCo--

ainsworth74 · Post by **ainsworth74** » Jul 20 2005

Balthagor wrote:PC Gamer UK Reviewed us?!?...

Which issue please!

It was August 05 issue 151. And they should have seeing as I sent them 2 emails!

The_Lightning_Count · Post by **The_Lightning_Count** » Jul 20 2005

This is an outrage! It's desecration, an insult, it's scandalous, prepostorous, crazy, ludicrous, it's absolutely outrageous, ridiculous, shocking, asinine, and exorbitant! No only that, it's absurb, idiotic, illogical, inane as well as insane, incongruous, unreasonable, and totally and completely unbelievable and nonsensical!

Well, on the bright side.... if there's one thing I got out of this it's that I pulled out a thesaurus to find more words to call this guy because I'm an uncreative lard butt who happens to be sofa king we-tah-did!

lmao

Sorry... couldn't help myself... lol... but seriously. Critics, who needs them? They don't create material of their own and they just criticize others because they aren't creative themselves. That may be a generalization, but why do we let critics speak for us anyways? I always find the best critic to be... myself! I mean hey, if I like it, it's good enough for -me-.

That's how it should work for everyone else, too. :p

Pajari · Post by **Pajari** » Jul 20 2005

PC Gamer and the rest of print gaming media have been going down the drain for quite a while now. This is just another pathetic example. They're inaccurate, out of touch, and most of the time they can't even write worth beans.

freddyg · Post by **freddyg** » Jul 21 2005

Although I disagree with the low score that this game received, I have put SR2010 aside for a while.
Why? Its not as much "fun" for me as I think it can be.

The economic development game is, to me, fun and fairly logical.

But the military part of the game is just too much work to be "fun". Although I'm sure the numbers are accurate, the military ratings are too complicated for me. Too many numbers, in print that is too small. I've played the Paris attacks a couple of times now, and it takes me about an hour and a zillion clicks to get uit building queues set up, activate units, group my units, get them going to where they're supposed to go. Then there is the problem of them moving from where I wanted them, even though I set their initiative down to 50. If I set it to zero, I'm afraid that they'll just sit there and get beat up when I am busy elsewhere. And I really don't have a clue as to how missles work.

So my hope is that an enterprising fan or developer will put out a quick and dirty military guide--how to automate stuff, which military numbers to focus on, how to quickly select units, etc.

Anyone know if such a guide exists?

BigStone · Post by **BigStone** » Jul 21 2005

freddyg wrote:Anyone know if such a guide exists?

Have a look at the wiki:

http://www.supremewiki.com/Main_Page

Don't know if you could find the answers to your q's.But it won't hurt...

Cheers

Post by **Balthagor** » Jul 21 2005

Have you read through the PDF Walkthrough document provided for Paris Attacks?

3iff · Post by **3iff** » Jul 21 2005

Even at initiative at zero, units will attack enemy units in range , they simply won't advance.

You should read the Paris attacks guide. You don't have to set units into groups - I rarely do (even though others might do so).

You should also use missions like these to experiment. I also suggest you try central America scenario as Panama. Look for the Pamana walkthrough post. This scenario has few units and a small economy. It should allow you to get to grips with the game without being overwhelmed.

Borodin · Post by **Borodin** » Jul 22 2005

I can accept spelling errors and mislabeled screens. Hell, I've seen that happen all over the place over the years. But the review's filled with flaws of logic. Only one major example is needed. Since when does depth of content equal confusion and lack of focus? If we begin with his premise, then a whole range of excellent games in all genres are very poor, simply because they cater to players who like rich gameplay.

Let's diss the Europa Universalis series.

Toss the Patrician series out the door!

Assassinate King of Dragon Pass.

Temple of Elemental Evil was buggy as hell and had wretched quests, but who cares? What's bad about it is its in-depth combat system, which everybody has praised.

SimCity? Level it.

I could go on...but why bother. PC Gamer has really, really lost it over the last several years, y'know?

Paolo · Post by **Paolo** » Jul 22 2005

Hi, all!

In the last issue (August) of the Italian magazine "Giochi per il Mio Computer" (Games for My Computer), there is the SR2010's review.
They have rated it 8 over 10.
For comparison: HoI2 was 8.5, Victoria 8, SuperPower2 6 (they don't use all the decimals, but only X or X.5 rates).
All these reviews have been written by the same, true strategist, gamer/reviewer.
He points out the problems of the first published version, but the vote is for the game with the second patch.
He explains well the steep learnig curve, expecially for not usual strategy gamers. But he likes the game. Quite a lot!